Webb - Dive! & you will win like ManU !
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Originally posted by Rock^Star:
zocoss, I wonder why this faggot hasn't been banned yet :)
Prob same reason a father cocker sucker like U also haven't been ban
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Originally posted by iceFatboy:
wow, u speak like King Kenny..
Anyway, pls stop labelling people or MU players for diving so easily.(I can easily find clips of Pool players diving also, as per U can find Rooney, so no one is an angel).
Any players know that once they are in the penalty boxes, and any contact can be rewarded by a penalty or yellow depending on angle of contact and call by referee.
this may be a "soft" touch, but given this is @ OT, I am sure the ref is "influenced" to give the penalty.
Merely stating the fact dude, especially in BPL where it is known as a very physical league. This kind of ugly act shouldn't be anywhere near football.A cheat is a cheat, no matter how you want to defend them. I am Liverpool supporter but condemned Gerrard when he dive or when Torres went to the ground with a slightest touch. They are bloody damn professional athletes but act like a pussy!
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Originally posted by Rock^Star:
after seeing that clip so many times which in fact doesn't show the part where berba fell, you are able to conclude it's not a penalty...amazing. It's a soft touch, even the commentator and soccernet reported so and berba made the most out of it.
Anyway, do you play football? Sometimes these things are hard to tell. You are running so fast that sometimes just a soft touch can get you to ground.
I watched the game dude. I watch every Liverpool game...I do play football as an amateur though. I know when you are running with full speed..even a slight touch will unbalance the player but the problem is Berbatov did not even sprint at that time, not running like Ronaldo!! You won't even get a penalty for that at La Liga...
See the vide here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0XFaCJLkOn4
Anyone good at body language?? see Berbatov interview here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKbaDKzcRJA
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Originally posted by zocoss:
Actually the clip is very good... Just watch Agger's left foot... Daniel Agger did clip Berbatov's right heel. It is soft but, no matter how soft it is, he shouldn't be doing that in the first place not when the ball is so far away... If anything, it's Agger's poor positioning that let Berba in and in trying to make up... He kind of panic tackle...
A clear view would be to look at the full body picture... Look carefully where was the ball and where was Agger's left foot attacking?
And don't just look at the foot, look at his right arm as well... He shouldn't be pushing him from the back either...
Looks more like he was going for the man rather than the ball...
Howard Webb was brave and made the right decision cos most referees wouldn't dare to give the home side a penalty in the first minute even if it is one... That's why he is considered one of if not the best in the world currently...
I felt the commentary seemed to favour Pool cos even Gerrard's outrageous two footed tackle on Carrick was deem ok at first and when Webb took out his red card, they were like in disbelieve Gerrard can be sent off kind but once the replay was shown... They kind of accepted it and couldn't find other excuses to defend him...
In my opinion, Howard Webb made 2 brave decisions and both were correct without a doubt...
Anyway, thanks for the clip...
The red card was a correct decision...two foot tackle definitely off no matter how you defend it. but not the penalty IMO.
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You guys can argue till the cows come home also useless, the match is over already, get over it.
My take: yes it's a penalty, but a tricky decision for the referee. Thankfully he's brave enough to make the right decision.
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Originally posted by Zweiz:
http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/8878/91434488.jpg
notice from pic1-3, there was no foot contact and berbatov's running posture was normal
notice pic4, berbatov still up and running, this is where he starts to dive
notice pic4&5, berbatov trying very hard to extend his left leg backwards - to hook agger and make it appear as if he was tripped
Nice picture but unfortunately it's only from one angle, and a poor one too... Look at this again, it will give a better view of the offence...
My question is... Did Agger's foot cut into Berbatov's path while he was running?
And last, did Agger get any touch of the ball during this whole process?
Even if he didn't touch him, which he did... a deliberate obstruction to his progress without playing for the ball would warrant one already... Howard Webb was so good probably too good that he even manage to catch that illegal act when most didn't notice...
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Originally posted by sg_forum:
I watched the game dude. I watch every Liverpool game...I do play football as an amateur though. I know when you are running with full speed..even a slight touch will unbalance the player but the problem is Berbatov did not even sprint at that time, not running like Ronaldo!! You won't even get a penalty for that at La Liga...
See the vide here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0XFaCJLkOn4
Anyone good at body language?? see Berbatov interview here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKbaDKzcRJA
yeh dude, that's cool...you watch every game. I have all the respect for genuine fans. Well, it's done and dusted.....maybe berba did, maybe not. Messi makes it a point to stay on his feet no matter what, others go down easily. It could be a trained instinct.
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Originally posted by sg_forum:
Merely stating the fact dude, especially in BPL where it is known as a very physical league. This kind of ugly act shouldn't be anywhere near football.A cheat is a cheat, no matter how you want to defend them. I am Liverpool supporter but condemned Gerrard when he dive or when Torres went to the ground with a slightest touch. They are bloody damn professional athletes but act like a pussy!
well, I did not watch the game, nor watch the video cause most times, one angle can't determine the exact picture of what happenend, and imptly, what the referee saw.
For me, I am in no haste to brand Berbacock a cheat cause once u brand him it takes eons or impossible to remove.
maybe, this time, he went to the ground easier than usual, but in a sense, he took the best of an opportunity to profit his organisation in an impt fa cup tie. ( I don't condone diving/cheating also).
Frankly, I would prefer MU to beat Pool in open plays and open goals or fair & square.
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Originally posted by iceFatboy:
maybe, this time, he went to the ground easier than usual, but in a sense, he took the best of an opportunity to profit his organisation in an impt fa cup tie. ( I don't condone diving/cheating also).
this explanation can be used for 90% of dives lor
dive just say dive la. he dived and got a penalty. ok, so what. liverpool (specifically gerrard) does that too. i saw maxi diving in the same match
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Originally posted by zocoss:
My question is... Did Agger's foot cut into Berbatov's path while he was running?
And last, did Agger get any touch of the ball during this whole process?
my question is... did berbatov fell due to obstruction or did he orchestrated his fall?
my opinion is he purposely fell, as evident by his left leg sticking back after a running posture. what's another word for it.... ummmm, dive?
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Originally posted by Zweiz:
my question is... did berbatov fell due to obstruction or did he orchestrated his fall?
my opinion is he purposely fell, as evident by his left leg sticking back after a running posture. what's another word for it.... ummmm, dive?
how do you run at a good speed and then stick the leg out behind such that it would get hooked, when the defender hustling you is quite in your blind spot?
Do you play football?
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Originally posted by Rock^Star:
how do you run at a good speed and then stick the leg out behind such that it would get hooked, when the defender hustling you is quite in your blind spot?
yeah maybe berbatov didn't dive. maybe he was shot.
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Originally posted by Zweiz:
this explanation can be used for 90% of dives lor
dive just say dive la. he dived and got a penalty. ok, so what. liverpool (specifically gerrard) does that too. i saw maxi diving in the same match
well... for me, technically, a dive is when no-one or nothing "touches" you, and U go over like a ton of brick.
"Simulation" is the new word isn't it now??
in this case, as I did not see it myself, I can't determine whether any "touches" him. If U watch the match, and over many angles, was he "touched"?
now, maybe he did "go over" when he was not even "touched" and in this case, I would say that he 'dived'.
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Originally posted by Zweiz:
my question is... did berbatov fell due to obstruction or did he orchestrated his fall?
my opinion is he purposely fell, as evident by his left leg sticking back after a running posture. what's another word for it.... ummmm, dive?
You haven't answer my questions...
Did Agger's foot cut into Berbatov's path while he was running? (Kindly refer to pictures)
And last, did Agger get any touch of the ball during this whole process? (Kindly refer to the video clip)
You know, obstruction to his progress is also a foul even if he didn't touch him...
There, if you would answer my earlier questions, you would get your answer...
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Originally posted by zocoss:
You haven't answer my questions...
Did Agger's foot cut into Berbatov's path while he was running? (Kindly refer to pictures)
And last, did Agger get any touch of the ball during this whole process? (Kindly refer to the video clip)
You know, obstruction to his progress is also a foul even if he didn't touch him...
There, if you would answer my earlier questions, you would get your answer...
Brilliant questions, short, simple and straight to the point.
Now we know the answer very clearly.
Thank you.
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Aiyah We got incidents of divings from Man Utd, Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal.. blah blah you name it.
This time a Man Utd player was caught in an unclear situation, next time might be a Chelsea player or something. If the Man Utd fans do not want people to make a big "huha" about it, just make sure next time when a player from another team is caught in an unclear situation just keep you all mouths SHUT lo.But wait, Berba's incident is not unclear but a clear penalty and that the anti- Man U fans just want to bring the club and the player down? Well, just make sure you dont do the same to other team and their players when they got players caught in controversy. What goes around comes around (Not referring to you fatboy). Same to fans of other football teams also.
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Originally posted by JusStatic:
Aiyah We got incidents of divings from Man Utd, Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal.. blah blah you name it.
This time a Man Utd player was caught in an unclear situation, next time might be a Chelsea player or something. If the Man Utd fans do not want people to make a big "huha" about it, just make sure next time when a player from another team is caught in an unclear situation just keep you all mouths SHUT lo.But wait, Berba's incident is not unclear but a clear penalty and that the anti- Man U fans just want to bring the club and the player down? Well, just make sure you dont do the same to other team and their players when they got players caught in controversy. What goes around comes around (Not referring to you fatboy). Same to fans of other football teams also.
well, u suggest a truce.. but quite impossible. To be fair, I am guilty of making "noise" la.okay, in your words, when i see a chelsea or etc player "dive" next, i diam diam.
anyway, we 'discuss' till our veins burst also no point, but just a bit of fun, friendly discussion only.
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Originally posted by zocoss:
Did Agger's foot cut into Berbatov's path while he was running? (Kindly refer to pictures)
And last, did Agger get any touch of the ball during this whole process? (Kindly refer to the video clip)
You know, obstruction to his progress is also a foul even if he didn't touch him...
my pictures has the answer - if you can't be bothered to see, i can't be bothered to reply
also, i can raised about 20 other 'obstruction to progress without touching' in the same game. what now, penalty shootout?
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Originally posted by iceFatboy:
well, u suggest a truce.. but quite impossible. To be fair, I am guilty of making "noise" la.okay, in your words, when i see a chelsea or etc player "dive" next, i diam diam.
anyway, we 'discuss' till our veins burst also no point, but just a bit of fun, friendly discussion only.
True
It is good la to have rivaries, if not it will be boring.. But sometimes the rivaries here have gone overboard. People creating fake IDs just to bash Man U or Liverpool or insults. Lol.
We see mindless bashing of Man Utd based on invalid grounds or mocking at Liverpool's demise or blind faith/support of Arsene Wenger's youth policies LOL.. Truely gone overboard hehe
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Originally posted by iceFatboy:
well, u suggest a truce.. but quite impossible. To be fair, I am guilty of making "noise" la.okay, in your words, when i see a chelsea or etc player "dive" next, i diam diam.
anyway, we 'discuss' till our veins burst also no point, but just a bit of fun, friendly discussion only.
If all of the fans can look at things from a non bias perspective, I am sure the discussion here would be much better.Critising Berba got nothing to do with the club but the individual...It is Berba that we are discussing about, not ManU. Almost everyone will try to get the best out of something that can benefit them. Even Roy Keane who strongly against diving did dive as well!! (http://www.searchgate.com/Roy_Keane_sent_off_for_Diving_v5345259/)??
I remember there was a player who protested to the referee after the referee giving him a penalty, he insisted that he was not touch! This is the player that we need in football! :) I can't remember the name though.
Even when Gerrard dive, I will condemn him to the max! We as a fans want to see exciting football where each team work hard to earn the points...not from this circumstances for sure.
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Originally posted by sg_forum:
If all of the fans can look at things from a non bias perspective, I am sure the discussion here would be much better.Critising Berba got nothing to do with the club but the individual...It is Berba that we are discussing about, not ManU. Almost everyone will try to get the best out of something that can benefit them. Even Roy Keane who strongly against diving did dive as well!! (http://www.searchgate.com/Roy_Keane_sent_off_for_Diving_v5345259/)??
I remember there was a player who protested to the referee after the referee giving him a penalty, he insisted that he was not touch! This is the player that we need in football! :) I can't remember the name though.
Even when Gerrard dive, I will condemn him to the max! We as a fans want to see exciting football where each team work hard to earn the points...not from this circumstances for sure.
fowler.
liverpool vs arsenal '97 i think...
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:)
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:)
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why dun all of us train our guns on theo walcott who actually admitted to diving???
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Originally posted by Zweiz:
my pictures has the answer - if you can't be bothered to see, i can't be bothered to reply
also, i can raised about 20 other 'obstruction to progress without touching' in the same game. what now, penalty shootout?
Yes, Your picture had the wrong answer I am afraid... And who said I can't be bothered to see? I have seen it very carefully and even enlarge it for a better view and still came to the same conclusion... And that is, your picture only show the poor angle of the foul as I had mentioned earlier...Such pictures are usually tailored to suit ones argument like in this case yours... Cos it doesn't even show the defender's foot cutting infront of the attacker's causing obstruction to progress...
The pictures I put up were taken from the video clip you so kindly provide to us... And it gave us a better and clearer view of the offence that took place...
I put it to you again and if you feel like entertaining us, kindly give us your answer to my earlier questions...
Did Agger's foot cut into Berbatov's path while he was running? (Kindly refer to pictures and video)
And last, did Agger get any touch of the ball during this whole process? (Kindly refer to the video)
Feel free to give us your reply, I am sure other are keen to know too...
Finally, just out of curiosity... Since you mentioned it, I really like to hear about the 20 other 'obstruction to progress without touching' that didn't end up a foul...
Just curious, don't mind me... lol...