NS Conscription Differences between Singapore & South Korea?
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if all koreans were like that serious marine no one would be bothering about bullying.why dont u just beat the crap outs of the b ully ?
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Originally posted by Daeho0228:
Beating the bully is quite unimaginable.. Koreans are so much used to
physical violence.. They just think being punched in the stomach or
kicked in the knee is something not unexpected especially in the armed
forces.. The Korean marine who shot his senior soldier and was
sentenced to death did that because his senior soldier set fire to his
bible saying, "I'm your senior soldier. So I am greater than Jesus."
As the marine was a pious Christian and got mad.. So he opened fire
on his senior soldier and threw grenades into the barracks..
Well.. Ok I see. Then I can call him His Excellency Senator
Lee Kuan Yew then..
I still think he is quite a benign leader..
General Chun, one of Korea's military dictators, killed more than 5000
people in Chunnam province because they protested against Kim Dae
Jung's being sentenced to death..
Yes.. imprisoning many people is by no means a good deed..
Nevertheless i still think it's much better than airdropping Special
Operation Forces in Chunnam province and ordering them to kill
anyone they saw..
You say His Excellency Senator Lee put many people in jail..
However, was any of them tortured? Korean dictators, especially
Generals Park and Chun imprisoned much more people.. and most
of them were tortured.. A typical Interrogator usually put his prisoner's
head into a basin full of water making the prisoner unable to breathe..
Some of them were practically castrated by being tortured
electronically.. Can you even imagine what being tortured
ellectronically is? Chun Sang Byung, a Korean poet was an infertile
man because he was neutered electronically when he was imprisoned..
Moreover female prisoners were tortured sexually.. I am unable to describe
how they were tortured because that's so very obscene..
That's why we Koreans think His Excellency Senator Lee is such a great
leader.. You know what? The incumbent president of South Korea, Lee
Myung Bak proudly showed a photo he took with His Excellency Senator
Lee when he was running for president. Many Koreans voted for Lee Myung
Bak because they saw the photo in which Lee Myung Bak and His Excellency
Senator Lee were shaking hands smiling..
Lee Myung Bak's predecessor, an ex human rights activist Roh Moo Hyun
frequently quoted from His Excellency Senator Lee's memoirs during his
debate with president candidates.. He was elected as president because
so many Koreans agreed with his quotations from His Excellency Senator Lee..
President Roh Moo Hyun even mimicked His Excellency Senator Lee by
sueing many newspapers for defamation..
In my view, Singapore is just like a grocery store that sells only apples..
It's true that you can buy only apples(meaning the PAP cadidates) at the
grocery store.. Anyways, all the apples are good... fresh, sweet and fragrant..
South Korea is a grocery store that sells apples, pears and durians..
The problem is that all the fruits in the grocery store are rotten.. Even
apples in the store smell just like durians and the durians there smell
even worse..
Former president Roh Moo Hyun commited suicide by jumping off a
cliff because he was about to be prosecuted for corruption..
Presidents Chun Doo Hwan and Roh Tae Woo were all imprisoned..
President Park, also known as Takagi Masao, didn’t go to jail because
he was assassinated by his henchman before he was sent to jail..
That’s why I say South Korea is a grocery store at which only
rotten fruits are available..
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Korean soldiers are equally underpaid and they usually split up with
their girlfriends while they’re doing military service. Usually draft
dodgers and black haired foreigners(meaning Koreans who have
American or Canadian Citizenship) have fun with their girlfriends..
A good example of those people who are allegedly draft dodgers
is Park Hae Jin.. He got exemption from doing military service
because he claimed that he was suffering from schizophrenia.
Maybe he was really a lunatic.. However, he seems to be perfectly
ok on TV.. He’s an actor..I heard many American Soldiers
in Afghanistan and Iraq are suffering from psychiatric problems but
still doing their job taking medicines such as Prozac.. Maybe he’s a
lunatic but he doesn’t seem to be bad enough to be exempted
from doing military service..
Most Koreans suppose he must have bribed doctors to get exemption
from military service.. Corruption and bribery are everywhere in South
Korea.. So their doubt is not totally unfounded I think..
Unlike Singapore, in which every singaporean son has to do military
service, South Korea is a country in which every korean son whose
parents are rich enough to bribe doctors don’t have to do military
service.. For some mysterious reason, few congressmen and cabinet
members in Korea did military service and even fewer of their sons
did military service.
A good example of black haired foreigners is Tablo the singer..
He was born to Korean parents in Korea, lived and is living in Korea..
He is a singer in Korea but a nobody in Canada. He earns money
in Korea but spends money in Canada.. Anyways he’s a Canadian..
He married a Korean actress.. I presume she may have had a
boyfriend who was doing military service.. And I suppose
she’ll give birth to another Canadian who has the same rights
as all other Koreans but has no duties such as military service..
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To sum up, You Singaporeans should be proud of your leaders, especially
His Excellency Senator Lee Kuan Yew. If His Excellency Senator Lee
were to run for president here in South Korea.. I’m sure he will win by
a landslide. If Koreans are able to vote for any of the PAP candidates,
they surely will do so because all other candidates are incompetent,
corrupt and unscrupulous.
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dear mr daeho,
i have kicked my officer in charge for incompetence and got away with murder.what are u going to say?god bless lee and mao tse tung
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and i did a big favour for the entire unit too after that.
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just do it smart ok!i know koreans are blunt....thats why it needs intelligence to beat up a bully.
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Originally posted by Daeho0228:
Beating the bully is quite unimaginable.. Koreans are so much used to
physical violence.. They just think being punched in the stomach or
kicked in the knee is something not unexpected especially in the armed
forces.. The Korean marine who shot his senior soldier and was
sentenced to death did that because his senior soldier set fire to his
bible saying, "I'm your senior soldier. So I am greater than Jesus."
As the marine was a pious Christian and got mad.. So he opened fire
on his senior soldier and threw grenades into the barracks..
Well.. Ok I see. Then I can call him His Excellency Senator
Lee Kuan Yew then..
I still think he is quite a benign leader..
General Chun, one of Korea's military dictators, killed more than 5000
people in Chunnam province because they protested against Kim Dae
Jung's being sentenced to death..
Yes.. imprisoning many people is by no means a good deed..
Nevertheless i still think it's much better than airdropping Special
Operation Forces in Chunnam province and ordering them to kill
anyone they saw..
You say His Excellency Senator Lee put many people in jail..
However, was any of them tortured? Korean dictators, especially
Generals Park and Chun imprisoned much more people.. and most
of them were tortured.. A typical Interrogator usually put his prisoner's
head into a basin full of water making the prisoner unable to breathe..
Some of them were practically castrated by being tortured
electronically.. Can you even imagine what being tortured
ellectronically is? Chun Sang Byung, a Korean poet was an infertile
man because he was neutered electronically when he was imprisoned..
Moreover female prisoners were tortured sexually.. I am unable to describe
how they were tortured because that's so very obscene..
That's why we Koreans think His Excellency Senator Lee is such a great
leader.. You know what? The incumbent president of South Korea, Lee
Myung Bak proudly showed a photo he took with His Excellency Senator
Lee when he was running for president. Many Koreans voted for Lee Myung
Bak because they saw the photo in which Lee Myung Bak and His Excellency
Senator Lee were shaking hands smiling..
Lee Myung Bak's predecessor, an ex human rights activist Roh Moo Hyun
frequently quoted from His Excellency Senator Lee's memoirs during his
debate with president candidates.. He was elected as president because
so many Koreans agreed with his quotations from His Excellency Senator Lee..
President Roh Moo Hyun even mimicked His Excellency Senator Lee by
sueing many newspapers for defamation..
In my view, Singapore is just like a grocery store that sells only apples..
It's true that you can buy only apples(meaning the PAP cadidates) at the
grocery store.. Anyways, all the apples are good... fresh, sweet and fragrant..
South Korea is a grocery store that sells apples, pears and durians..
The problem is that all the fruits in the grocery store are rotten.. Even
apples in the store smell just like durians and the durians there smell
even worse..
Former president Roh Moo Hyun commited suicide by jumping off a
cliff because he was about to be prosecuted for corruption..
Presidents Chun Doo Hwan and Roh Tae Woo were all imprisoned..
President Park, also known as Takagi Masao, didn’t go to jail because
he was assassinated by his henchman before he was sent to jail..
That’s why I say South Korea is a grocery store at which only
rotten fruits are available..
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Korean soldiers are equally underpaid and they usually split up with
their girlfriends while they’re doing military service. Usually draft
dodgers and black haired foreigners(meaning Koreans who have
American or Canadian Citizenship) have fun with their girlfriends..
A good example of those people who are allegedly draft dodgers
is Park Hae Jin.. He got exemption from doing military service
because he claimed that he was suffering from schizophrenia.
Maybe he was really a lunatic.. However, he seems to be perfectly
ok on TV.. He’s an actor..I heard many American Soldiers
in Afghanistan and Iraq are suffering from psychiatric problems but
still doing their job taking medicines such as Prozac.. Maybe he’s a
lunatic but he doesn’t seem to be bad enough to be exempted
from doing military service..
Most Koreans suppose he must have bribed doctors to get exemption
from military service.. Corruption and bribery are everywhere in South
Korea.. So their doubt is not totally unfounded I think..
Unlike Singapore, in which every singaporean son has to do military
service, South Korea is a country in which every korean son whose
parents are rich enough to bribe doctors don’t have to do military
service.. For some mysterious reason, few congressmen and cabinet
members in Korea did military service and even fewer of their sons
did military service.
A good example of black haired foreigners is Tablo the singer..
He was born to Korean parents in Korea, lived and is living in Korea..
He is a singer in Korea but a nobody in Canada. He earns money
in Korea but spends money in Canada.. Anyways he’s a Canadian..
He married a Korean actress.. I presume she may have had a
boyfriend who was doing military service.. And I suppose
she’ll give birth to another Canadian who has the same rights
as all other Koreans but has no duties such as military service..
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To sum up, You Singaporeans should be proud of your leaders, especially
His Excellency Senator Lee Kuan Yew. If His Excellency Senator Lee
were to run for president here in South Korea.. I’m sure he will win by
a landslide. If Koreans are able to vote for any of the PAP candidates,
they surely will do so because all other candidates are incompetent,
corrupt and unscrupulous.
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Hi, you mean in Korea 's army, if an soldier is incompetent said for example he is an lousy shooter, he can still bribe his way to get top markmanship performance ? And do korean men lose out in career advancement after they finished serving the army ? Still I resumed that basic welfare will be given to your people like medical, insurance or maybe some leisure activities like the playstation game for break time etc. Also if it an korea 's minister 's son will to serve in the army, will they given special treatment like extra break time or maybe their senior sergeant carry his army bag for him things like that ?
You might like to watch "Every Singaporean Son" to know more about our NS lifestyle : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gxmp8nwQ43Q and do korea soldier had worst treatment like this US army unit ? : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FTVLKGsZCKc
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Childish leh. No time to find extra money already. Still fight here and there. Grow up la.
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would korean soldiers repeat the nanjing rapes if they were to be sent overseas?as daeho said theres bullies and violence and bad japanese habits?
its self discipline of each soldier really.
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Stop trolling, sHitman.
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Daeho, I think Korea has a fearsome military in part from such practices, but it would be better if senior soldiers did not treat their soldiers' loyalty as limitless.
Correct me if I'm wrong, I think the behaviour of senior soldiers is something they learnt in school, and is a reason some Korean girls prefer Koreans of foreign nationality.
And I've always wanted to know about Chunnam. Precious little is written in English. What was the true number of dead and missing? Is it true that paratroopers from the northern and central provinces were chosen for their antipathy towards people of the south? Or did they massacre their countrymen out of blind obedience, being told they were all communists?
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Honestly, I think you Singaporeans overestimate Koreans..
In my view, Koreans are quite subservient.. We ousted our
dictators not because we were so much fond of democratic
values but because their corruption and incompetence was
so much unbearable..
If we had had a great leader like His Excellency, the leader
or the successor he or she appointed would be still the
president of South Korea..
No.. No.. the leader doesn't have to be as great as
His Excellency.. A leader as competent as Senior Minister
Goh would be good enough for us..
By the way.. I think the Korean Armed Forces can not be
a match for the Singapore Armed Forces..
In time of war, all senior soldiers and officers of the Korean
Armed Forces will be shot by their junior soldiers..
While I was doing military service, my fellow soldier said,
"If I have to go to war, then I will shoot Sergeant Kim, Lieutenant
Lee ...." The list of the senior soldiers and officers he wanted
to kill was endless..
In peacetime, we dare not do so because we would be surely
sentenced to death.. However, in time of war, it is so natural
that soldiers are shot by their enemy. So we can just go to fight
and shoot the senior soldiers and came back to report that
our senior soldiers were killed by the enemy..
Who can gather evidence of our murder and prosecute us?
So we are so very free to do so..
That’s why we South Koreans were unable to defeat the
North Korean Invaders on our own.. And that’s why we
still need the US Armed Forces in Korea..
would korean soldiers repeat the nanjing rapes if they were to be sent overseas?as daeho said theres bullies and violence and bad japanese habits?
I’ve got a Malaysian friend who goes to a graduate school here in Korea.. In labs
in Korea, there are people who are called senior students.. Most of them are
veterans and they do exactly what they learnt in the Korean Armed Forces..
The Malaysian friend, who is a muslim, was forced to drink wine.. The senior
student said, “You son of a b**** put into your mouth whatever that I order
you to drink.. Be that urine or anything worse..“
So you can imagine what the Korean soldiers are capable of doing overseas.
As I have told you.. The Korean Armed Forces are the living fossil of the
Japanese Imperial Armed Forces.. They will do exactly what their predecessors
did in Nanjing.. I must say real Koreans are not the people you see in
Korean soap operas or K pop music videos..
Well.. It’s true that Korean girls prefer foreigners.. A friend of
mine is also dating a Singaporean man.. Of course, the friend is
a girl.. However, be warned.. The Korean girlfriend you think
pretty is not necessarily a real beauty.. I mean she is highly
likely to be a man made beauty.. I mean plastic surgery..
To be honest, getting married to a Korean girl is the same
as getting married to a cyborg..
Is it true that paratroopers from the northern and central
provinces were chosen for their antipathy towards people of the south?
That is highly likely to be true.. In my view, soldiers from Kyungsang
province must have been chosen.
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Or did they massacre their countrymen out of blind obedience,
being told they were all communists?
That’s true.. the troops were told that the people in Chunnam
province were all controlled by communist spies from North Korea..
Of course, soldiers from Chunnam province would have known
that was a lie. So I suppose most of the paratroopers were from
Kyungsang province..
A textbook on the modern history of Korea(both north and south)
readily available on the market is Korea’s place in the Sun by
Professor Cumings.. As he married a Korean woman and has lived
in Korea for a long time.. His book is much better than other texts.
However, I must say his views are somewhat biased..
I think the book is available at any good libraries in Singapore..
And you may read reviews on the book at
http://www.amazon.com/Koreas-Place-Sun-History-Updated/dp/0393327027/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1326945286&sr=8-1
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Thanks for the info. I indeed have read chapters of this book before.
I think our Singapore system has produced good results before, but because we can have only apples, we cannot change them when the apples go bad. Our leaders have been neglecting our country of late, they have closed their ears for too long and only awoken at the year's elections. The upcry was that life has been getting worse and in large part due to their conscious action. Of our three leaders I must accord Lee Senior the most credit, I would credit Goh with only a weak continuation of his course of action. Lee Junior has done better than Goh, and has been more liberal, but has inherited most of the problems stewed on Goh's watch. Goh denied our country continued investment but the costs became apparent only after he stepped down.
Lee Senior has fists of iron but had somewhat functioning ears. Goh has somewhat softer fists, but his ears are airtight.
I have this personal theory about the soldiers in Chunnam being slapped around for two years, "paying back" what they saw as a bunch of arrogant college students. Far from being communist, to the soldiers the students represented everything about upper class society.
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Peoples Action Party under LKY
Action Party under GCT
The Party under LSL.
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There’s a Korean saying that goes as follows.
<The old party is better than a new party.>
In my opinion, what happened in Taiwan is a good
example of what the saying means.
Taiwanese people were fed up with the corrupt
Nationalist party. So they voted for the Democratic
Progressive Party candidate.. That’s why Chen Shui
Bian was elected.. Years later, Taiwanese people
realized that the DPP was by no means less corrupt
than the Nationalist Party and elected a Nationalist
Party candidate. That’s why Ma Ying Jieu was elected..
Currently, Chen Shui Bian is in prison and Ma Ying Jieu
is the re-elected president of Taiwan..
I mean you Singaporeans may elect a non PAP candidate
in future.. However, you will soon be disappointed and
vote for the PAP candidate in the next election.
We Koreans have the same experience. Although we
still have hope.. Some day we will have a leader..
as great as His Excellency.
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Originally posted by Daeho0228:
There’s a Korean saying that goes as follows.
<The old party is better than a new party.>
In my opinion, what happened in Taiwan is a good
example of what the saying means.
Taiwanese people were fed up with the corrupt
Nationalist party. So they voted for the Democratic
Progressive Party candidate.. That’s why Chen Shui
Bian was elected.. Years later, Taiwanese people
realized that the DPP was by no means less corrupt
than the Nationalist Party and elected a Nationalist
Party candidate. That’s why Ma Ying Jieu was elected..
Currently, Chen Shui Bian is in prison and Ma Ying Jieu
is the re-elected president of Taiwan..
I mean you Singaporeans may elect a non PAP candidate
in future.. However, you will soon be disappointed and
vote for the PAP candidate in the next election.
We Koreans have the same experience. Although we
still have hope.. Some day we will have a leader..
as great as His Excellency.
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You mean Mr Ban Ki-moon, the UN Secretary-General is not an great leader ? Your country had a lot of successfully entrepreneur leaders like Samsung and LG Group,not to forget your country is the leading in area of game designer and entertainment like "Rain"(He is even number 1 in Time Magazine Top 100 influential people in the world) , why feel so down as if there is no good president or goverment leader in korea is an loss ?And as mention early, will korean guy lose out in their career after they left their army unit or will your employer will promote you or pay you higher salary if they found that what is your previous army 's hierarchy after service, say if you are an sergeant etc.
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Originally posted by M the name:
You mean Mr Ban Ki-moon, the UN Secretary-General is not an great leader ? Your country had a lot of successfully entrepreneur leaders like Samsung and LG Group,not to forget your country is the leading in area of game designer and entertainment like "Rain"(He is even number 1 in Time Magazine Top 100 influential people in the world) , why feel so down as if there is no good president or goverment leader in korea is an loss ?And as mention early, will korean guy lose out in their career after they left their army unit or will your employer will promote you or pay you higher salary if they found that what is your previous army 's hierarchy after service, say if you are an sergeant etc.
I think he is disillusioned with Korea. Don't expect Daeho to praise the chaebols or the entertainment scene.
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if an soldier is incompetent said for example he is an lousy shooter, he can
still bribe his way to get top markmanship performance ?
No. Because rich kids don’t do military service.. They just bribe doctors
and somehow get the medical certificate that says he is unable to do
military service.
And do korean men lose out in career advancement after they finished
serving the army ?
Of course.. That’s why most korean mem don’t want to
do military service..
Still I resumed that basic welfare will be given to your people like medical,
insurance or maybe some leisure activities like the playstation game for
break time etc.
That’s true but well.. Korean soldiers can go to hospitals run by the
Ministry of Defence without paying any money.. The problem is the
doctors in the hospital are second rate doctors.. So most korean
soldiers choose to go to private hospitals and pay the due price of
the medical service they get.. Leisure activities are granted
that’s true. They usually enjoy computer games such as starcraft..
However, you have to be a sergeant to enjoy such games..
If a Korean army private courageously attempts to enjoy
comupter games.. I can tell you he will be most brutally
punched and kicked by sergeants.
if it an korea 's minister 's son will to serve in the army,
will they given special treatment like extra break time or maybe
their senior sergeant carry his army bag for him things like that ?
No. Because for some mysterious reason.. Most sons of Korean
ministers are such handicapped persons that they are somehow
unable to do military service.
Well it’s true that their nephews have to do military service.
Anyways their nephews somehow get many privileges. So we
call them honey licking bastards..
You mean Mr Ban Ki-moon, the UN Secretary-General is not
an great leader?
I don’t know much about him.. He’s a nobody in Korea..
Although it is known that he was former minister of foreign affairs..
Your country had a lot of successfully entrepreneur leaders like
Samsung and LG Group..
Most Korean businessmen and businesswomen are
bribe givers. of course we cannot blame them becaues they
were forced to give bribes by corrupt politicians..
Still I don’t think they deserve respect..
Although I do respect one businessman. His name is Kim Yong Pok.
He was a Korean businessman running a construction company
that built highways in Saudi Arabia.. His Korean workers wanted to
eat radishes and cabbages.. of course those vegetables were not
available in the deserts of Saudi Arabia. So he attempted to grow
those vegetables.. Although he failed many times but after a lot
of trial and error managed to harvest those vegetables.
The Saudi Arabian Government was impressed and offered to
invest a lot in his farm.. From then on he successfully harvested
fruits such as strawberries and finally wheat..
That’s why Saudi Arabia is now self sufficient in wheat..
The Saudi Arabian government rewarded him handsomely for his
agricultural feat.. and he’s a billionaire. From then on he has
been providing poor kids with scholarships and stipends..
His scholarship boys and girls are now judges, economists, scientists,
teachers and professors..
I do respect Rain because he is now doing military service. Sadly,
most other Korean singers and actors are.. for some mysterious reasons
again.. such paralysed people that they don’t do military service..
Although he is doing military service.. Rain is now guarded by a pack
of Military Police officers.. Because the Ministry of Defence believes he
is also likely to fall victim to the rampant violence in the Korean Army.
I hope the protection works and he won’t be brutally punched and kicked..
And as mention early, will korean guy lose out in their career after they
left their army unit or will your employer will promote you or pay you
higher salary if they found that what is your previous army 's hierarchy
after service..
No good thing happens after doing military service in Korea..
It’s just a waste of time and energy.. I think Korean young men
are being exploited by the Government.. Do you know how much
a Korean soldier is being paid?
less than 100 US dollars per month.. A Big Mac burger costs
5 US dollars in Korea.. so after buying 20 Big Mac burgers and
you spent all your monthly pay in Korea..
Don;t you think it’s outrageous?
Yeah.. you can refuse to do military service in Korea.. at the cost of
spending about 5 years in prison though.. I heard Taiwanese soldiers
are paid about 700 dollars every month.. that’s still not enough but
much more than what their Korean counterparts are paid..
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Thank you Mr Daeho0228 for your informative reply, anyway to keep this thread alive, I would shared with you some insight of our Singapore Armed Force and maybe we will see if there are any similar in Korean armed force :
1) Most singaporen if they decided to sign on to SAF, the most important reason is because of good salary. (Through I would not agreed with the work scope) Link : http://www.mindef.gov.sg/imindef/careers/job_opportunities/io/officer/salaryscale.html
and this does not included the overtime done on guard duty etc. And for people who want to further your university study, there is an SAF Scholarship for them which they have to sign bond/contract and served their unit for about 6 years : http://www.mindef.gov.sg/content/imindef/careers/scholarships/scholarships/SAFOS.html Because for those singaporean who signed on either because of salary or scholarship, they have an "common" mindset that their choice is part of climbling their career ladder, so they would "try" not do anything that jeopardize their future, didn't your country have similar monetary/work as you study reward to attact talent to the army, especially facing the threat from the north ?2) During my NS day, I observed that only homosexual/gay recruit are the one that are commonly being "pushed" and been tease of. For example I have seem recruits who march back to their room (not from my unit) , some rascal push one sissy recruit back to hurry "him" up for the march. In korea, any interesting similar case happen to the gay as well? Didn't tell me they get beaten as well?
3) In Singapore where girl didn't have to do National Service. I think because of curiosity that why singapore girl want to sign on the Singapore Armed Forced to experience what is army 's life whether is it fun or "adventurous", usually nothing negative had been heard from them being "bully". In fact their physical exercise and test is much more relaxed than boys, and since they are considered to be "extraordinary" to take up the challenge of SAF as their career, the ladies' SAF personnel are always well-respected and most possibly they will be featured in the media or newspaper. Is this the same phenomenon as for the korean girls that they shared the same interest to join army cos I cannot imagine what will happen to Jessica Jung (one of the vocalist of Girl Generation) if she choose to sign on korean army for "adventurous or patriot" reason instead of pursue an entertainment career. Even if there are korean lady who really wanted to join army or police force just as in the movie "My Girlfriend Is An Agent", would they be well respect in their fields and free from violence ? (No offence to girls).
Thank you.
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Our glorious people's republic always welcomes you, Daeho.