Originally posted by insidestory:Yeah, it makes you wonder just how low these specialists will go. As long as you pay them, they will write anything for you. Even rubbish. Have you checked out the stories from expats on how they are fleeced left right centre by these specialists in private practice who anyhow quote prices, or recommend unnecessary treatments? One of my friends was quoted by a specialist in Mt E $8k for a simple blood sample test. When the specialist found out she's Singaporean and only speaks like an American cos she was away for 7 yrs since she's 17, he said ok just for since you're Singaporean, $4k. Later my friend went to SGH and got the test done for $25.
I think the specialists business is kept alive by a sizeable number of NSFs here. I remember one soldier who got his specialist to write that his skin was allergic to the SAF bed, (not mattress, but bed) so he can't stay in and another soldier who managed to get a specialist dumb enough to write that the soldier is "allergic to officers".
most likely those 'hackjob' doctors are usually foreigners or ladies who arent that aware -.-" [the local guys are more scrutinisng based on their previous MO experience unless they themselves heck care for the sake of money =.=] however, there isnt much that can be done as their professional licence's terms and conditions rarely cover nsf-related stuffs and such [as long as no malpractice causing injury/death/life threat is present]..
Do anything but don't get caught. The TS now got caught so can only blame himself for being stupid and suay.
When I was in ns, I took 30 to 40 days mc in the 10 months before I ord and I didn't get caught and I ord in peace.
TS consider yourself suay
Originally posted by schi_zo:Hi all, just a question. I was slapped with a charge of 10 days DB, for taking my exams on mc. My leave was not enough to cover the full duration of my exams den my unit don't allow me to use off also. If a paper is missed, the whole subject will be deemed as absent.
So i bo pian go take exam during my mc, then now kena charged. Somemore i have specialist letter stating it is very important for me to take my examination. So my OC charge me but i don't plead guilty, transfer to CO, charge me but i also don't plead guilty, then to court martial.
Questions, are.. how long will i receive the letter to go for court martial?
Is my offence justified for 10days DB? (my CO was planning to give more)
I got discharged (PES F), expecting to get my IC next week, den if go court martial found guilty still under military rule?
Any advice for hiring a defence lawyer??
If I am you, I am no push over. I will bring every resources, I have from media, mp, SAF hotline, and EVERYTHING. Since the CO or OC or whatever is being informed I will whack every1 upside down. Anyway, EXAM and TESTs are very important events in life and it is necessary for life to go on and even after you ORD. If whoever on top is not being understanding, than he does not deserve to be a commander at all.
I read somewhere that taking EXAM off, compensation leave, birthday off in the directive and handbook before, I am not sure if it is still exists. Check it out urself.
Anyway who say taking MC must stay home AND REST? It is only written black and white on the MC say you are unfit for work and is not valid for court. Have you all ever read the MC and medical directive before? Where on paper that it is being written that you have to stay home and rest?
Anyway the idea of giving an MC is not to rest, but more like isolation, because that person may be spreading the cold and flu virus around. If he is injured, it may be difficult to walk around.
Good Luck to TS. I have not problem getting OFF for my scholarship interview, driving test, and other stuff before,hence therefore...
Hi all, my mc was related to my studies and i had my mc several months before the examinations, not the 1 day 2 day flu cough kind. Side note, I was referring to A levels.
I have NEVER EVER applied for leave, nor OFF, not even once in my ~2years of NS, it was always told that 'company off' today, but my off wasn't deducted and my leave was instead. Of course i wasn't informed till I wanted to apply for my exams. Lack of leave left me to ask to apply OFF for my exams, but i was denied. Already at THIS point of time, I am already on mc.
I was scheduled to go for my unit's major exercise but in the end i was excused from it and allowed to go for my exams. So during my exams, there was no way there could a clash of NS activities, as my unit was away for the exercise. But they just don't want to let me use off, excuse me, let me go for exam but dont let me use off, justified? In my initial post, if i missed a paper, the whole subject is deemed as absent, so aren't they playing me? So my question is there such a directive that cannot use off to go for exams?
I am confused that some replies were directed angrily, which I cannot see the point behind it, as my case doesn't harm you anyway, does it? I view my education as an important bridge to working life, so that's why i chose my path. If you think the value of conscription is greater than the importance of education, then I must salute you, great asset of the SAF.
Originally posted by schi_zo:Hi all, my mc was related to my studies and i had my mc several months before the examinations, not the 1 day 2 day flu cough kind. Side note, I was referring to A levels.
I have NEVER EVER applied for leave, nor OFF, not even once in my ~2years of NS, it was always told that 'company off' today, but my off wasn't deducted and my leave was instead. Of course i wasn't informed till I wanted to apply for my exams. Lack of leave left me to ask to apply OFF for my exams, but i was denied. Already at THIS point of time, I am already on mc.
I was scheduled to go for my unit's major exercise but in the end i was excused from it and allowed to go for my exams. So during my exams, there was no way there could a clash of NS activities, as my unit was away for the exercise. But they just don't want to let me use off, excuse me, let me go for exam but dont let me use off, justified? In my initial post, if i missed a paper, the whole subject is deemed as absent, so aren't they playing me? So my question is there such a directive that cannot use off to go for exams?
I am confused that some replies were directed angrily, which I cannot see the point behind it, as my case doesn't harm you anyway, does it? I view my education as an important bridge to working life, so that's why i chose my path. If you think the value of conscription is greater than the importance of education, then I must salute you, great asset of the SAF.
Seriously, this kind of stuffs are such simple things. Your boss should be able to handle this well. How can it turn out so bad?
I meant most of the sign on are uni grad, they should understand the need of his men to take his A level and stuff. They are themselves pretty highly educated too. it is just strange.
IT is OVERALL very very funny.
What I have to say is this:
By right, you're not even really supposed to take outside courses or take external examinations, etc while you're doing full-time NS. If you're given time off to do so, it is a privilege and not a right, and it is subject to the discretion of the commanders as to whether or not such a privilege can be given.
Otherwise, as others have pointed out, we'll have queues of people demanding time off to go for driving lessons, piano lessons, BTT, FTT, C programming courses, etc.....
Seriously, it does not matter what the MC is for; when you're on Attend C, you're expected to spend your time at home (except to perhaps go to the hawker center to buy dinner or something).
Bottom line is, the words 'full-time' in the term 'National Service Full-time' means exactly that: you are a full-time soldier. If you want to do other things, then please do it at your own time, and do not let it get in the way of your full-time duties as an NSF.
Originally posted by schi_zo:Hi all, my mc was related to my studies and i had my mc several months before the examinations, not the 1 day 2 day flu cough kind. Side note, I was referring to A levels.
I have NEVER EVER applied for leave, nor OFF, not even once in my ~2years of NS, it was always told that 'company off' today, but my off wasn't deducted and my leave was instead. Of course i wasn't informed till I wanted to apply for my exams. Lack of leave left me to ask to apply OFF for my exams, but i was denied. Already at THIS point of time, I am already on mc.
I was scheduled to go for my unit's major exercise but in the end i was excused from it and allowed to go for my exams. So during my exams, there was no way there could a clash of NS activities, as my unit was away for the exercise. But they just don't want to let me use off, excuse me, let me go for exam but dont let me use off, justified? In my initial post, if i missed a paper, the whole subject is deemed as absent, so aren't they playing me? So my question is there such a directive that cannot use off to go for exams?
I am confused that some replies were directed angrily, which I cannot see the point behind it, as my case doesn't harm you anyway, does it? I view my education as an important bridge to working life, so that's why i chose my path. If you think the value of conscription is greater than the importance of education, then I must salute you, great asset of the SAF.
Are you studying in any school now? Who gave you the permission to go take your exams? Did you tell them you have this exam way beforehand? Are you medically certified to take exam? The whole situation sounds like you are taking part-time education, allowed but troublesome. Sounds like your superiors didn't exactly gve you the rights to take the exam. But you play some stunt and go take MC for the exam. So what the MC say? Medically certified you to take exam instead of serving NS?
Originally posted by schi_zo:Hi all, my mc was related to my studies and i had my mc several months before the examinations, not the 1 day 2 day flu cough kind. Side note, I was referring to A levels.
I have NEVER EVER applied for leave, nor OFF, not even once in my ~2years of NS, it was always told that 'company off' today, but my off wasn't deducted and my leave was instead. Of course i wasn't informed till I wanted to apply for my exams. Lack of leave left me to ask to apply OFF for my exams, but i was denied. Already at THIS point of time, I am already on mc.
I was scheduled to go for my unit's major exercise but in the end i was excused from it and allowed to go for my exams. So during my exams, there was no way there could a clash of NS activities, as my unit was away for the exercise. But they just don't want to let me use off, excuse me, let me go for exam but dont let me use off, justified? In my initial post, if i missed a paper, the whole subject is deemed as absent, so aren't they playing me? So my question is there such a directive that cannot use off to go for exams?
I am confused that some replies were directed angrily, which I cannot see the point behind it, as my case doesn't harm you anyway, does it? I view my education as an important bridge to working life, so that's why i chose my path. If you think the value of conscription is greater than the importance of education, then I must salute you, great asset of the SAF.
You are just suay lah. You take mc several months and even get PES F now so your unit OC and CO see you bei song and want to charge you and see you suffer.
Originally posted by Lokey:If I am you, I am no push over. I will bring every resources, I have from media, mp, SAF hotline, and EVERYTHING. Since the CO or OC or whatever is being informed I will whack every1 upside down. Anyway, EXAM and TESTs are very important events in life and it is necessary for life to go on and even after you ORD. If whoever on top is not being understanding, than he does not deserve to be a commander at all.
I read somewhere that taking EXAM off, compensation leave, birthday off in the directive and handbook before, I am not sure if it is still exists. Check it out urself.
Anyway who say taking MC must stay home AND REST? It is only written black and white on the MC say you are unfit for work and is not valid for court. Have you all ever read the MC and medical directive before? Where on paper that it is being written that you have to stay home and rest?
Anyway the idea of giving an MC is not to rest, but more like isolation, because that person may be spreading the cold and flu virus around. If he is injured, it may be difficult to walk around.
Good Luck to TS. I have not problem getting OFF for my scholarship interview, driving test, and other stuff before,hence therefore...
I beg to differ on the day off directive thingy, ultimately the unit still has its SOP to follow and still have to depend if commanders allow or not.
As for the MC, yes it didn't state that one should stay home and rest, but doesn't mean it allows one to be taking part in another activity if one is genuinely sick.
Once again, I think that off is really dependable on commanders. If they are those that can close one eye, then everything would be smooth. But if there are bastard officers around, then have to be careful or else will step into their traps.
PES F can directly discharge by CMPB right?
no need to go back reservist too and have anymoe contact with Army right?
but then the Court Martial sentence, they might still be able to sentence someone with PES F if the offence is committed before discharge, but to involve a PES F in DB sounds silly.
Originally posted by loki_chaos:I beg to differ on the day off directive thingy, ultimately the unit still has its SOP to follow and still have to depend if commanders allow or not.
As for the MC, yes it didn't state that one should stay home and rest, but doesn't mean it allows one to be taking part in another activity if one is genuinely sick.
Once again, I think that off is really dependable on commanders. If they are those that can close one eye, then everything would be smooth. But if there are bastard officers around, then have to be careful or else will step into their traps.
So all in all TS's commanders suck, probably is some no-brainer sign on fellow. A simple EQ problem, at the end made it into such as big matter. A bad sheep in the high rank is making people condemning the SAF as a whole. And whoever have actually sign on, really reflect their intellect.
So the commander even know that sending people to DB eventually to martial court reflect badly on their portfolio as well.
Originally posted by Lokey:So all in all TS's commanders suck, probably is some no-brainer sign on fellow. A simple EQ problem, at the end made it into such as big matter. A bad sheep in the high rank is making people condemning the SAF as a whole. And whoever have actually sign on, really reflect their intellect.
So the commander even know that sending people to DB eventually to martial court reflect badly on their portfolio as well.
I got a feeling the commanders must be some condemned cannot make it regulars and now trying to take it out on their subordinates
Originally posted by schi_zo:Hi all, just a question. I was slapped with a charge of 10 days DB, for taking my exams on mc. My leave was not enough to cover the full duration of my exams den my unit don't allow me to use off also. If a paper is missed, the whole subject will be deemed as absent.
So i bo pian go take exam during my mc, then now kena charged. Somemore i have specialist letter stating it is very important for me to take my examination. So my OC charge me but i don't plead guilty, transfer to CO, charge me but i also don't plead guilty, then to court martial.
Questions, are.. how long will i receive the letter to go for court martial?
Is my offence justified for 10days DB? (my CO was planning to give more)
I got discharged (PES F), expecting to get my IC next week, den if go court martial found guilty still under military rule?
Any advice for hiring a defence lawyer??
from some of your previous threads, it's obvious that you have been a huge prick to your fellow soldiers and your superiors .....
hoh seh liao lah .... now look who's got the last laugh now ......
have fun in DB.
Originally posted by Fatum:from some of your previous threads, it's obvious that you have been a huge prick to your fellow soldiers and your superiors .....
hoh seh liao lah .... now look who's got the last laugh now ......
have fun in DB.
that's what makes ppl go on fire the most...
AFAICR in summary, that guy's OC seems to lean towards the pai kia PS and the mono guys, just bcos he cannot blend in with the platoon due to background differences [and from there, wants to make life difficult and virtually strips him of his welfare + trying to get him into trouble even when it was not caused by him] and the PS concerned only sides with the mono guys. [1 of the case mentioned is whereby the TS was really sick and that PS did not believe him at all and insist he chao geng]
i wonder where the PC and the sect comms went to... being gagged and silenced? -.-
You should pleed guilty.
In black and white, if you take MC, you must stay at home, cannot go out shopping etc, there will be spot check from MP sometimes (But they spot check on those perm MC people la, 1week or 2weeks mc they dont bother to check)
Black and white already said MC = stay at home, what makes you think you got right to go take exam? Specialist write letter so what? If your OC/Co dunno you take exam, and the exam is private, then quiet quiet nobody know then good, but now every body know already, better to pleed guility serve the 10days DB.
I guess TS will be the one after DB, he got discharged....
Originally posted by Lokey:If I am you, I am no push over. I will bring every resources, I have from media, mp, SAF hotline, and EVERYTHING. Since the CO or OC or whatever is being informed I will whack every1 upside down. Anyway, EXAM and TESTs are very important events in life and it is necessary for life to go on and even after you ORD. If whoever on top is not being understanding, than he does not deserve to be a commander at all.
I read somewhere that taking EXAM off, compensation leave, birthday off in the directive and handbook before, I am not sure if it is still exists. Check it out urself.
Anyway who say taking MC must stay home AND REST? It is only written black and white on the MC say you are unfit for work and is not valid for court. Have you all ever read the MC and medical directive before? Where on paper that it is being written that you have to stay home and rest?
Anyway the idea of giving an MC is not to rest, but more like isolation, because that person may be spreading the cold and flu virus around. If he is injured, it may be difficult to walk around.
Good Luck to TS. I have not problem getting OFF for my scholarship interview, driving test, and other stuff before,hence therefore...
MC never say, SAF law say. Who say must stay home and rest? SAF did. You argue MC never say also no use, they got this simple thing covered, you think you can find some loop hole meh?
Originally posted by schi_zo:Hi all, my mc was related to my studies and i had my mc several months before the examinations, not the 1 day 2 day flu cough kind. Side note, I was referring to A levels.
I have NEVER EVER applied for leave, nor OFF, not even once in my ~2years of NS, it was always told that 'company off' today, but my off wasn't deducted and my leave was instead. Of course i wasn't informed till I wanted to apply for my exams. Lack of leave left me to ask to apply OFF for my exams, but i was denied. Already at THIS point of time, I am already on mc.
I was scheduled to go for my unit's major exercise but in the end i was excused from it and allowed to go for my exams. So during my exams, there was no way there could a clash of NS activities, as my unit was away for the exercise. But they just don't want to let me use off, excuse me, let me go for exam but dont let me use off, justified? In my initial post, if i missed a paper, the whole subject is deemed as absent, so aren't they playing me? So my question is there such a directive that cannot use off to go for exams?
I am confused that some replies were directed angrily, which I cannot see the point behind it, as my case doesn't harm you anyway, does it? I view my education as an important bridge to working life, so that's why i chose my path. If you think the value of conscription is greater than the importance of education, then I must salute you, great asset of the SAF.
You NEVER took leave before, check. Company off day your leave got deducted, check.
Now... how much leave you left with? how come not enough, your exams is 10 days or 20 days ah?
If you inform them way before hand, how come the leaves are not planned far in advanced? If OC reject you, why you never take the matter up to CO or call SAF hotline?
Why angry? No, it is you who are angry and blaming the whole world. Somehow, you REFUSE to acknowledge that this thing is your fault, even after so many post pointing out your mistakes. From that, anyone can tell what a fuck up person you must be, and how hard it is to work with you, and why no one wants to help you.
Originally posted by collinnxk88:that's what makes ppl go on fire the most...
AFAICR in summary, that guy's OC seems to lean towards the pai kia PS and the mono guys, just bcos he cannot blend in with the platoon due to background differences [and from there, wants to make life difficult and virtually strips him of his welfare + trying to get him into trouble even when it was not caused by him] and the PS concerned only sides with the mono guys. [1 of the case mentioned is whereby the TS was really sick and that PS did not believe him at all and insist he chao geng]
i wonder where the PC and the sect comms went to... being gagged and silenced? -.-
my answer to that is very very simple ..... if you have served, you would have known how unlikely it is to be outstracized by everybody in a unit. People need each other in a unit, or more pointedly, they have better things to do than to go out of their way to get you. So if you think everybody in uniform doesn't like you or is against you, not your unit mates, not your PS, not your PC, not your OC, not even the MO ..... then the fault can only lies with you, from your behaviour and actions, you must have alienated everyone of these people.
And of course, judging by the TS' winning personality .... I really think it's no wonder he could find scant sympathy towards him, even from his own parents.
http://www.sgforums.com/forums/1390/topics/380075
fun fact #5. They got the TS good and proper this time.
I wonder if they are throwing a party somewhere.
As an nsf pc, I must say that off is a privilege and leave is a right. That's all to it.
By directive, since you are talking about taking A levels here, the unit should make provisions for you to take your exams to meet the minimum education bar (Poly, NITEC or A levels) provided IT DOES NOT CONFLICT WITH OPERATIONAL REQUIREMENTS. What constitutes 'Operational Requirements' is rather grey and if your OC hates you then ho seh liao, he will use this reason against rejecting your off and leave requirements.
For most units, the OCs and PCs are kind and understanding enough to grant you the off or to approve the leave if you so wish to apply for it. However, since your OC is not approving it and your PC is like not supportive of it, it looks like you are 'marked'/disliked in your unit. At least that's what I do to those guys who always take MCs for the most minor of reasons (sore throat).
As for MC, do not listen to Daveteo's crap. It is by SAF law that when you are on MC, you are supposed to be recuperating at home. Worse still, I have made people who are MC for sore eyes/sore throat take taxi all the way back to camp to rest in bunk. Very simple reason to why I do such things - if I let one get off scot-free, I am just being unfair to the rest and they will start playing MCs, making more trouble for me. Some units, in fact, do not allow those on MCs to go home but to rest in the bunks instead. If you are resting at home, the unit can conduct home visits and if you are found to be malingering, the Military Police can be called in to arrest you.
You played with fire in spite of knowing the risks and got burnt. Too bad, you have to suck thumb and face the music. Dude, you are no longer a child but an adult. Be responsible for your own actions.
No point activating media/parents/MPs over your case. It will only embarrass you and your family. Suck thumb and go to the GCM. I have, on more than one occasion, allowed my men to go on urgent overseas leave/urgent offs because of unforeseen circumstances. However, your case... Blame it on your willingness to play with fire.
Originally posted by collinnxk88:most likely those 'hackjob' doctors are usually foreigners or ladies who arent that aware -.-" [the local guys are more scrutinisng based on their previous MO experience unless they themselves heck care for the sake of money =.=] however, there isnt much that can be done as their professional licence's terms and conditions rarely cover nsf-related stuffs and such [as long as no malpractice causing injury/death/life threat is present]..
The hackjobs are Singaporean, and most specialists here are men, so by logical extension most of the hackjobs are men. It's extremely difficult for a foreign doctor to set up a private practice here, so there are very few. All private sector doctors, even mere GPs don't treat the NS malingerers any differently, so there is no need for special terms for NSFs in their professional license. Hackjobs whom you pay a lot to are generally very lax and dispense medication and MCs and diagnoses very freely.
When questioned later, its quite easy to just say they were erring on the side of caution. Anything can be explained away as being cautious and if faced with an enquiry from SMC, they can just pull out some obscure statistic of one person somewhere in Timbuktu who ever had this allergy to "officer" and went berserk everytime he saw an officer in 1765 to justify himself.
Originally posted by Daveteo:I got a feeling the commanders must be some condemned cannot make it regulars and now trying to take it out on their subordinates
You're obviously a retard. In most coys there is an equal portion of NSF PC and regular PC. Only an idiot from an unprivileged background will think that the only people who can become an officer must sign on some farmer LSA award to do so. Its damn common to find an officer in a group of friends in poly and the bottom JCs and do you know in certain circles here, I know of the odd specialist who didn't become officer in NS unlike his friends continues to be laughed at and humiliated by the NSF officers in university.but of course, that's in a US university and all the Singaporeans there are of almost the same mould and background, and that guy is the only spec among the Singaporean male students who are all officers soo...
All regulars go through their PC tour, the most basic and simplest of command tours including the SAFOS or president's scholars. For farmers, the OC tour is the last command tour for most of them. No more space for them up the pyramid, wide at the bottom tapers narrowly to a tip on top. You sound like a retard who is condemned to a life of pathetic sadness with no brightness or future possibility. Your CEP in life will probably peak at $2,000 in a HDB handphone shop. Sad.
Originally posted by Lokey:So all in all TS's commanders suck, probably is some no-brainer sign on fellow. A simple EQ problem, at the end made it into such as big matter. A bad sheep in the high rank is making people condemning the SAF as a whole. And whoever have actually sign on, really reflect their intellect.
So the commander even know that sending people to DB eventually to martial court reflect badly on their portfolio as well.
Commanders will normally close an eye when it comes to good soldiers, I know you're illiterate and dense, which is why you failed to pick this up repeatedly even though it was said by at least three NS officers here. TS is obviously a marked case and those fucked up soldiers who caused headache and trouble for his officers. If I'm his PC, i'll also make sure my OC whacks him big time and send him to DB for life.
I find it amusing how you are totally self justified over something that is not allowed. It's been said by so many people, some officers and some not, that its not allowed and he did it. But as usual your failure to understand English due to your illiteracy is a stumbling block to a normal life for you.
I know a lot of commanders who have sent lots of people to DB. Nothing happened to them as a result of that. It's the fucked up soldiers who paid the price for being fucked up, and I'm quite sure they'll carry their deep seated character flaws into their post-ORD life..after they serve out the rest of their extended NS days after DB. As for TS, i'm sure you'll enjoy the lovely exercise, pleasant ambience and nice gourmet meals you are about to enjoy in your 10 day holiday. Have fun!!!
Through this forum, I found out the mentality and psyche of these fucked up soldiers that I've to deal with in camp. Most of them however don't reveal their real feelings to me of course, now I know these fucked up and marked soldiers actually feel so much self justification about their misdeeds and bad attitude,don't think they did anything wrong and think its all the commanders' fault. I will make sure that such soldiers suffer and get whacked with harsher consequencies from now on and recommend to my OC maximum charges for them every time they even try to pull a fast one.