Why NS ?
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Many questioned on the need for local boys serve the National Service. There are a few out there who will go all out to find reasons to skip NS, while others think it's a must for local boys to serve NS.
What do you think?
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I think Singaporean boys should not be educated, so that they will be more humble, loyal to the country, more faithful in their relationship, less social conscious, honest, shy, and easier to listen to their girls.
Ohh....and they won't even doubt or REQUIRE A REASON to do their NS.
Gone are the days when I'm Cleopatra and Loyal Men served me.
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Of cos it will.
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Originally posted by parn:
I think Singaporean boys should not be educated, so that they will be more humble, loyal to the country, more faithful in their relationship, less social conscious, honest, shy, and easier to listen to their girls.
Ohh....and they won't even doubt or REQUIRE A REASON to do their NS.
Gone are the days when I'm Cleopatra and Loyal Men served me.
You are not thinking. If the effect is going to be turned to that extent, girls are the ones who are going to serve NS. If girls are the "favoured" gender, it is only right that the responsibilities are falling on their heads.Besides, after having all of the benifits of education, suddenly removing it from them will induce a big riot.
For loyal people to serve you, you must be capable. As capable as cleopatra to run the country singlehandedly. It was said that she did single handedly save eygpt from the clutches of rome. Can you do that? What respect do you deserve?
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i really don't understand people nowadays. National service is meant to be a platform for boys to proudly serve their country. It is the transition from boys to men. why do so many people want to "chaokeng" or skip NS, especially when they are healthy from head to toe? I have heard of some very fit people who when accepted to join commandos, are unwilling. There are many people who also commented that when they go NS, they will try to lead a slack life.
On one hand, there are so many opportunities for these fit people, yet they reject these offers for specialist courses. There are a handful of people on the contrary who want to serve as specialists - maybe commandos or divers, and are unable to because of their eyesight, not because they are unfit.
also national service will definitely toughen up the generation a bit more, it is not as if one has to go through hell week or is expected to do 100 chinups every day (which is still quite reasonable). all is required is to don on army wear and run that 2.4km or go through the firing practices.
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Guys must be educated lah.. For me, i think it is good for our boys to go through some hardships.. So far, NS has made all the boys i know a better person!
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yes of cos definitely good
支�!
one thing though, pls train them to be less whiny about it
and can u pls edit your pharked up post? -
how come people in taiwan, isreal are less whiny about it?
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after going through NS, a boy becomes a men
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A guy who dun serve NS...ends up as a wuss in a way or two
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Its a good thing if it is seen so and people will gain more from it.
Most guys just take it as a waste of time so they had closed off whatever opportunity to learn more things.
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Originally posted by mistyblue:
Its a good thing if it is seen so and people will gain more from it.
Most guys just take it as a waste of time so they had closed off whatever opportunity to learn more things.
Spot on. It all comes down to the individual.
The ones who are so shallow that they see it as a waste of time would whine about and fuck up anything they come across, not just NS.
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Capable is the last word that I'd choose to describe Cleopatra.
On to the matter at hand. Military service is definitely useful for the country (less so to the individual), but many people seem to go out of their way to avoid it. There's many possible reasons for this, chief among which is the time spent. 2 years is not insignificant, and it puts the male citizens of the country at a considerable disadvantage. To offset this, military service ought to open up more opportunities. At present, only the armed forces 'scholars' get any benefits other than the pittance that they pay you for lugging all that kit about. We do get a slight pay increment (compared to a similar job for a woman) when we work in Singapore, but it's not nearly enough to offset the time spent.
Another reason is patriotism, or rather, the lack thereof. People in certain quarters have raised the point that the newer generation doesn't show a great deal of love for their country, and with good reason. They don't recognise that 'national identity' and other words to that effect are simply a great deal of crap. Patriotism is inherently irrational, since you're devoting yourself to an arbitrary cause without any acutal reason to exist. Anybody with a thimble of sense can see that it's a paper-thin pretext to get young men to defend this place. Fuck that, I say. There are many causes for which I'd be willing to lay my life down, but defending a country is not it.
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benefit foreigners..
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it will benefit the country.. but whether it will benefit the individual is up to himself..
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Originally posted by ExtraVehicular:
Capable is the last word that I'd choose to describe Cleopatra.
On to the matter at hand. Military service is definitely useful for the country (less so to the individual), but many people seem to go out of their way to avoid it. There's many possible reasons for this, chief among which is the time spent. 2 years is not insignificant, and it puts the male citizens of the country at a considerable disadvantage. To offset this, military service ought to open up more opportunities. At present, only the armed forces 'scholars' get any benefits other than the pittance that they pay you for lugging all that kit about. We do get a slight pay increment (compared to a similar job for a woman) when we work in Singapore, but it's not nearly enough to offset the time spent.
Another reason is patriotism, or rather, the lack thereof. People in certain quarters have raised the point that the newer generation doesn't show a great deal of love for their country, and with good reason. They don't recognise that 'national identity' and other words to that effect are simply a great deal of crap. Patriotism is inherently irrational, since you're devoting yourself to an arbitrary cause without any acutal reason to exist. Anybody with a thimble of sense can see that it's a paper-thin pretext to get young men to defend this place. Fuck that, I say. There are many causes for which I'd be willing to lay my life down, but defending a country is not it.
Considerable disadvantage? It simply depends on your attitude.
So you would say "fuck it" to defending what you like?
Fine. It's probable you don't feel attached to this place.
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- This is the question that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friends
- Some people started asking it, not knowing what it was
- And they'll continue asking it forever just because:
- This is the question that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friends
- Some people started asking it, not knowing what it was
- And they'll continue asking it forever just because:
- This is the question that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friends
- Some people started asking it, not knowing what it was
- And they'll continue asking it forever just because:
- This is the question that never ends, yes it goes on and on my friends
- Some people started asking it, not knowing what it was
- And they'll continue asking it forever just because:
- x infinity....or till they end National Service or we get invaded by aliens.
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if you dont mind other people dictating how u live and control your freedom, sure, why not?
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Originally posted by mrvictor:
i really don't understand people nowadays. National service is meant to be a platform for boys to proudly serve their country. It is the transition from boys to men. why do so many people want to "chaokeng" or skip NS, especially when they are healthy from head to toe? I have heard of some very fit people who when accepted to join commandos, are unwilling. There are many people who also commented that when they go NS, they will try to lead a slack life.
On one hand, there are so many opportunities for these fit people, yet they reject these offers for specialist courses. There are a handful of people on the contrary who want to serve as specialists - maybe commandos or divers, and are unable to because of their eyesight, not because they are unfit.
also national service will definitely toughen up the generation a bit more, it is not as if one has to go through hell week or is expected to do 100 chinups every day (which is still quite reasonable). all is required is to don on army wear and run that 2.4km or go through the firing practices.
Serve NSmen i think you mean.
I don't see in which way is doing NS serving the country.
And NS life is not good.
No don't get me wrong, i aint saying that NS isnt neccessary.
But after 5 months in NS, i only see NSF like me serving NSmen.
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Originally posted by ExtraVehicular:
Capable is the last word that I'd choose to describe Cleopatra.
On to the matter at hand. Military service is definitely useful for the country (less so to the individual), but many people seem to go out of their way to avoid it. There's many possible reasons for this, chief among which is the time spent. 2 years is not insignificant, and it puts the male citizens of the country at a considerable disadvantage. To offset this, military service ought to open up more opportunities. At present, only the armed forces 'scholars' get any benefits other than the pittance that they pay you for lugging all that kit about. We do get a slight pay increment (compared to a similar job for a woman) when we work in Singapore, but it's not nearly enough to offset the time spent.
Another reason is patriotism, or rather, the lack thereof. People in certain quarters have raised the point that the newer generation doesn't show a great deal of love for their country, and with good reason. They don't recognise that 'national identity' and other words to that effect are simply a great deal of crap. Patriotism is inherently irrational, since you're devoting yourself to an arbitrary cause without any acutal reason to exist. Anybody with a thimble of sense can see that it's a paper-thin pretext to get young men to defend this place. Fuck that, I say. There are many causes for which I'd be willing to lay my life down, but defending a country is not it.
I have a different take on that.
Speaking as a quitter of 14 years, I still hold that my national service was a fair trade-off for the stable environment provided in the preceding 18 years of my life. There might have been better places for a kid to grow up, but there certainly could have been worse, and that is in part due to the contribution of NS men during those years, so I don't see any inequity in the requirement to serve. It's a matter of reciprocation rather than patriotism. If anything, having completed my service made my leaving Singapore with a clear conscience much easier.
Apart from the social angle, there's much to be personally gained from performing national service IMHO. In many countries, students take a gap year between leaving high school and entering univeristy, to expand their horizons before starting tertiary education. Admittedly, two years (or two and a half in my case) is significantly longer, but speaking personally, being out of school for that period gave me the space to gain perspective, and the lessons and insights gained during that time came in handy when I returned to my studies, and continue paying benefits to this day. I can still easily outlast colleagues 12 years my junior, and having had to perform without sleep for 105 hours certainly provided great training for what they would term long days at the office.
It's the same with NS as with anything else - you simply get out what you put in.
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One way to put it:
Govt make us do NS, the unit that is responsible had better make sure to utilise us to help them, not leave us sitting around confined in a room with nothing better to do...
If not, it is pointless to make us do NS...WASTE TIME ONLY
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Originally posted by sIaN87:
after going through NS, a boy becomes a men
not true not at all -
Originally posted by 16/f/lonely:
Considerable disadvantage? It simply depends on your attitude.
So you would say "fuck it" to defending what you like?
Fine. It's probable you don't feel attached to this place.
In case it escaped your notice, I repeatedly state my very low view of patriotism and fighting for arbitrary causes in my post. I'm not about to go lay down my life for a drawing on a map. The choice between being a rabid patriot and a 'traitor' is a false dichotomy.
Besides, it's highly unlikely that any would-be invader would rape, burn and pillage their way through Singapore since there's too much infrastructure at stake for them to simply discard it all.
@ Gedanken: I'm of the opinion that our military isn't a much of a deterrent. Singapore is ill-equipped to wage the kind of intense urban warfare (i.e. fighting for the kitchen and getting shot at from the bedroom) that would be necessary for us to resist any invader. Who are we kidding? The moment war breaks out, we're going to face a great deal of trouble in bringing in resources to continue the fight. Also, after our inevitable capitulation, any invader would be more inclined to be vicious with the civilian populace if they had previously faced dogged opposition from our troops.
You do raise several good points in your second paragraph. Yes, military service is not without its benefits, but in my view, it still penalizes the male section of the populace quite unfairly. Instead of getting the freedom to choose, we're forced into bondage for the two years, and the supposed compensation doesn't come anywhere close to offsetting the effort demanded.
Also, gender equality and feminists can go jump off a cliff if males are still the only ones expected to defend their country.
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benefit to a certain degree... at least some mama's boys learn how to take care of themselves. but i still feel more cons than pros. anyway, i guess gers do not really understand our feelings as they do not need to serve NS. 1) 2 yrs of our prime youth taken away. 2) after 2 yrs, we lag behind our female counterparts. imagine at age 21 u juz ord, going to start uni while ur female counterparts r graduating. they will start work earlier n earn $$ earlier. the only comforting tot is that gers age faster... =D 3) the annual reservist that we have to attend. during annual ict, many pple said they dunno whether the company will still want them anot when they go back to work after reservist (especially those general jobs that include operations etc). imagine u need to go for 3 weeks of ict, ur company finds a part-timer to take ur place. after 3 weeks, the part-timer can do ur job as well as u but at a much lower pay. wat will the company tink? it's only those who had gone thru the 2 yrs or 2.5yrs that can really feel it, especially those stay-in personnel. to those stay-out personnel who kept saying admin work is xiong, yes i agree but stay-in combat personnel has it tougher. this is my personal take after being in both combat n admin scenes during my army stint. lastly, to those who keng... it's arseholes like u that made pple wif genuine cases unable to downgrade or be excused without deep scrutinization. to top it up, NS does benefit... but 2 yrs is too long, especially during the primetime of youth.
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ya i agree.2 yrs is too much.maybe 1 yr is enough