Original Sin (Of Angels and Man)
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Satan was created by GOD to have an independent mind. I would say Satan is the author of evil and sins. The fall of Adam allows sin to creep in.Originally posted by laurence82:It still doesnt answer the question.
Who created evil or sins? Satan? And where he get the notion of sins and evil? He was created by god rite? -
I agree with u that Einstein do not believe in god. He was shattered by the holocaust.Originally posted by Icemoon:In the first place, Einstein did not really believe in a personal God. So it's not his pattern to discuss things in the quote. -
After the fall of men, I believe so.Originally posted by M©+square:Back to Topic.
When a infant is formed/created by God. Is the fetus sinful and fall short of the glory? -
Hmm, the rest were right about not trying to prove who is superior in knowledgeOriginally posted by laoda99:Can u do a better job?
If this is what you want in EH fine by me.
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Nope, its abt whether he has the guts to admit he is wrong, take measures to make sure stuff posted in this topic is more credible, more coherent, more consistent.Originally posted by laoda99:He is human. Leave him alone. -
It is easier to criticize, but would be good if u can take up mod. Then we can see whether u will be better than him.Originally posted by laurence82:Hmm, the rest were right about not trying to prove who is superior in knowledge
If this is what you want in EH fine by me.
I will never criticize brey when he make mistake as mod as I dun think it is an easy job. -
A: Its not about whether you have done a good job, Its about whether you have tried to do so. It irks me not because he posted something slanderous, but when proven so, shirk away from the issue.Originally posted by laoda99:It is easier to criticize, but would be good if u can take up mod. Then we can see whether u will be better than him.
I will never criticize brey when he make mistake as mod as I dun think it is an easier job.
B. Stop being a nice guy. Something is done, so it must be improved, corrected or by anyway other way make things better. The last time me would have taken your line, but now i believe in progress rather than being wishy washy around you know, being neutral, he is a human lar, leave him alone lar...
Sorry, no can do. -
Originally posted by laurence82:Nope, its abt whether he has the guts to admit he is wrong, take measures to make sure stuff posted in this topic is more credible, more coherent, more consistent.
It is quite correct to state that being a mod is NOT easy. No one said that it's easy.Originally posted by laoda99:It is easier to criticize, but would be good if u can take up mod. Then we can see whether u will be better than him.
I will never criticize brey when he make mistake as mod as I dun think it is an easy job.
However the issue is not about the difficulty of modding, the issue is about the accuracy of quoting from outside sources and what is being done if the quotation is erroneous.
I do not see the need to "challenge" laurence to be a mod in EH for two reasons, he will not and he cannot. It should be noted that lau is already a mod elsewhere, to judge if he is a good mod or not should take place in the forum where he presides. -
What kind of progress are u looking for? Sorry, I am not a nice guy nor I am neutral, but I do not believe it is nice to shout "slander!" and get so worked up just becoz he misquoted.Originally posted by laurence82:A: Its not about whether you have done a good job, Its about whether you have tried to do so. It irks me not because he posted something slanderous, but when proven so, shirk away from the issue.
B. Stop being a nice guy. Something is done, so it must be improved, corrected or by anyway other way make things better. The last time me would have taken your line, but now i believe in progress rather than being wishy washy around you know, being neutral, he is a human lar, leave him alone lar...
Sorry, no can do.
Everybody make mistakes. Live and let live. There would come a time when u make mistakes too. -
hmm, its interesting. Its obvious that i cannot, but the 'i will not' part? Its interesting to know, in your opinion, why is that so?Originally posted by Chin Eng:It is quite correct to state that being a mod is NOT easy. No one said that it's easy.
However the issue is not about the difficulty of modding, the issue is about the accuracy of quoting from outside sources and what is being done if the quotation is erroneous.
I do not see the need to "challenge" laurence to be a mod in EH for two reasons, he will not and he cannot. It should be noted that lau is already a mod elsewhere, to judge if he is a good mod or not should take place in the forum where he presides.
The obvious answer is that i am no a christian, but unker has something else in mind?
Anyway, all the four forums i mod are crap forums - ie, nonsensical, for fun, relaxation....for better guide to better mods, look at the forums with serious discussions - Speaker Corner, SAF forum, Military Nuts etc etc -
Hi Chin Eng,Originally posted by Chin Eng:It is quite correct to state that being a mod is NOT easy. No one said that it's easy.
However the issue is not about the difficulty of modding, the issue is about the accuracy of quoting from outside sources and what is being done if the quotation is erroneous.
I do not see the need to "challenge" laurence to be a mod in EH for two reasons, he will not and he cannot. It should be noted that lau is already a mod elsewhere, to judge if he is a good mod or not should take place in the forum where he presides.
As far as I know, Brey has misquoted and the thing that pissed lau is that he haven apologize for that.
Not just Christians, all men have a tendency to "jump" at something which we find favourable to our beliefs. But I believe Brey does not have bad intentions when he misquoted. I do not believe we should be so work up and shout "slander!" at him just becoz he misquoted. And I detest anyone who use this example of misquote to stereotype christians as using unreliable sources.
From looking at his posts, he has been a good mod. Mebbe he would not have invited so much criticism if he isn't the mod. I would still say give Brey a break and not dwell on the misquote too much. -
sorry if I'd offended you. I don't think you'd be interested to mod a Christian forum. I'd not be interested in modding Bar either. Conflict of interest?Originally posted by laurence82:hmm, its interesting. Its obvious that i cannot, but the 'i will not' part? Its interesting to know, in your opinion, why is that so?
The obvious answer is that i am no a christian, but unker has something else in mind?
Anyway, all the four forums i mod are crap forums - ie, nonsensical, for fun, relaxation....for better guide to better mods, look at the forums with serious discussions - Speaker Corner, SAF forum, Military Nuts etc etc
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Dude, do you read the posts? Was the issue so simple as just 'misquoting'?Originally posted by laoda99:What kind of progress are u looking for? Sorry, I am not a nice guy nor I am neutral, but I do not believe it is nice to shout "slander!" and get so worked up just becoz he misquoted.
Everybody make mistakes. Live and let live. There would come a time when u make mistakes too.
Gee, am i that petty for a momentary lapse? You dont even bother reading the rest of the issue, did you?
Again, as i have said, was it solely on the mistake? The issue is, he made a mistake, what to do next? That is the issue. -
Originally posted by Chin Eng:sorry if I'd offended you. I don't think you'd be interested to mod a Christian forum. I'd not be interested in modding Bar either. Conflict of interest?
No lar no offense, just curious -
I agree.... even to the point that Brey has NO BAD INTENTIONS....Originally posted by laoda99:Hi Chin Eng,
As far as I know, Brey has misquoted and the thing that pissed lau is that he haven apologize for that.
Humans always have a tendency to "jump" at something which we find favourable to our beliefs. But I believe Brey does not have bad intentions when he misquoted. I do not believe we should be so work up and shout "slander!" at him just becoz he misquoted. And I detest anyone who use this example of misquote to stereotype christians as using unreliable sources.
From looking at his posts, he has been a good mod. Mebbe he would not have invited so much criticism if he isn't the mod.
The issue is NOT about the intentions... it is about the apology - which did not happen. Unfortunately, most peeps will have a higher expectation from a mod, any mod... especially in a forum NOT noted for it's humour or crap.
I also do not agree on the "slander" thing - which by definition is not within the context of the debate.
However, I do not see any attempt to stereotype Christians in any way. -
U want him to apologize, and he did not and that piss u off.Originally posted by laurence82:Dude, do you read the posts? Was the issue so simple as just 'misquoting'?
Gee, am i that petty for a momentary lapse? You dont even bother reading the rest of the issue, did you?
Again, as i have said, was it solely on the mistake? The issue is, he made a mistake, what to do next? That is the issue. -
Hmm, reading all ur posts, who is the one dwelling on misquote per se?Originally posted by laoda99:Hi Chin Eng,
As far as I know, Brey has misquoted and the thing that pissed lau is that he haven apologize for that.
Not just Christians, all men have a tendency to "jump" at something which we find favourable to our beliefs. But I believe Brey does not have bad intentions when he misquoted. I do not believe we should be so work up and shout "slander!" at him just becoz he misquoted. And I detest anyone who use this example of misquote to stereotype christians as using unreliable sources.
From looking at his posts, he has been a good mod. Mebbe he would not have invited so much criticism if he isn't the mod. I would still say give Brey a break and not dwell on the misquote too much.
Again, intention may be good, but it can never justify for actions, especially if the move is erroneous one. Its the same as terorism, the intention is good, the method..then you go to go back to question the intention again...
Stop harping on this misquote alone, look at the bigger picture of what everyone has been saying. It annoying you dont see the point and pushing everything down in just pure defence of a guy.
And its stupid to say because you have good intention, that doesnt mean you do post anything to back you up, or when in doing so, injures somebody else views and reputation. Is the respect for another human being dismissed just like that? Gee -
Gee, is that it? Wow, you can ignore the rest of the posts and only pin point this? GoodOriginally posted by laoda99:U want him to apologize, and he did not and that piss u off. -
This is the best post i have seen in this thread so far.Originally posted by klydeer:Hi Laurence. Just sharing here some of my thoughts as i have thought about it some time back.
Wouldnt think that Sin is "created". Rather to me, it is a consequence or act of disobedience from what is commanded by God and what is God.
When the Lord created beings - He gives them free will. As we all know - Free Will is a double edge power. Keeping the options simple here - Either to submit or to deviate. So if one is to deviate from what the Lord has for the beings brings forth sin. Sinning brings forth death.
i do not know what occurred in satan's heart when he disobeyed God - but perhaps a simpler analogy would be that having meals to be kept alive is not sin - but gluttony is. We are not forced by the Lord to be or not to be a glutton - we chose to. Perhaps satan chose to / or desire to because even as an angel - he covet out of a freedom to do so?
Why does the Lord gives us free will then ? Perhaps If we do not have free will - most probably we also cannot enjoy the Good that the Lord has for us ? More for the children of Adam - we cannot know what Love is ? We would be like robots....isnt it ?
That Evil is the absence of Good only begs the question further. That Evil is chosen by the will of Men and (Angels) brings forth much light of God's Love for Beings of Which He Created. That is one of the major relevations that brings me to Christ as i was indeed a very bad person then. It is not so much of the blessings that God can bring - but of His grace that i can choose to Live and Live truly.
Hope all is well with you. -
Yes it is slander. Albert Einstein has a view point which he held strongly, if you posted something he did not say, that injurious to his character. And i detest those who in defence of others, chose to push all this down as 'mere misquote'. Where is the respect for other human beings? Its equivalent to saying, anything can be used to justify oneself, if make a mistake, never mind.Originally posted by Chin Eng:I agree.... even to the point that Brey has NO BAD INTENTIONS....
The issue is NOT about the intentions... it is about the apology - which did not happen. Unfortunately, most peeps will have a higher expectation from a mod, any mod... especially in a forum NOT noted for it's humour or crap.
I also do not agree on the "slander" thing - which by definition is not within the context of the debate.
However, I do not see any attempt to stereotype Christians in any way.
What is not in the context of the debate?
And again, i emphasised also the need to try to make things more credible, more consistent. Somebody can ignore all that and just aim for me asking for an apology? -
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Brey has said this, i replied to himOriginally posted by laoda99:It may be hard for u to believe, but the god of the jews and the god of christians is the same. It is just that Christians believe that Christ is the messiah while jews are still waiting for their messiah.
Go read if you bother, coz i aint repeating, -
AE is a bad example to use here. Anyway, I dun see why the concept of Holy trinity and the new testament should come in here.Originally posted by laurence82:Totally out of point.
Thats not what I meant.
Anyone who dont do a double take might miscontrue Albert Einstein supporting Christianity, the concept of Holy Trinity and the News Testament. You said it, presence of evil means absence of God.
You think the Jews would actually support the notion of God laid out in the New Testaments? An easy trap for evangelists to gain more persuasive power in the name of Albert Einstein.
And we are still not in the clear what Albert himself mean by God. It may not be even a Jewish or Christian notion of God. We are still on assumptions here.
I am against overzealous evangelists who misquote to gain more persuasive power. But Brey is not one.
Are u AE's fan? -
U are pissed that he skirt around the issue without answering ur question and without apologising. To u, misquote is a sin in academia. I agree with u.Originally posted by laurence82:And again, i emphasised also the need to try to make things more credible, more consistent. Somebody can ignore all that and just aim for me asking for an apology?
From all your shouts of "slander!", I think he would be more careful in the future. -
Its not even AE's work in the first place.Originally posted by laoda99:AE is a bad example to use here. Anyway, I dun see why the concept of Holy trinity and the new testament should come in here.
I am against overzealous evangelists who misquote to gain more persuasive power.
Are u AE's fan?
Let me put in a simpler way. Same god, different biographies
Why the Judaism and Christianity? Because, remember, i am talking abt the notion of god, not whether its the exact same god. I dont think the Jews in Judaism would like to think Christians have the same notion of god as them, same as Christians to Muslims. Hence, they dont believe in Jesus, same as Christians dont believe Mohammed is a prophet of god, and the tonnes of doctrinal differences.
If you still cant get the idea, sit down , have a cup of coffee over it.
If you realise, if brey has from the start say, this is from a christian author or works, then things would not have gone so haywire.