Originally posted by lemon1974:Frankly speaking, there is no need for 3 doors SD. Less seatings n the last door won't benefit much ppl. Ppl seated near the middle door will likely to exit from the middle exit. No of standees at the rear is usually less than 10. N that step is so high. (Look similar to those private PPSS or CDS buses). You won't be able to exit fast also because of the high steps
DD with 3rd door will be fine though.
Then AT LEAST shift the rear door to the back... Not chuck it in the middle...
Originally posted by gekpohboy:Lyout also affcts flw of pax. Can try remve seats & re-position doors.
Use longitudinal seating at the back lor... Like Sunway BRT
Then these buses anchor short haul...
Originally posted by TIB429E:Hmm..don't really get what you mean. But I think it's possible to just simply add a "flat platform" on a full low floor buses right? It need not be that high actually...
Just search for pictures of Citaro LE and look at the additional step needed to go to the "normal" seats. Its much higher than any LE bus here, and also look at the slope of the rear aisle.
The problem with your suggestion regarding low floor buses is that, the current products in the market are all sloped, this is because the engine components are located beneath the floor (on the left hand side of the bus), and this is done because there needs to be clearance underneath the rear overhang for the bus to travel through different road/slope profiles. You could make it higher, and flat, but that means there may be more steps to the rear section, in which case, it is not advisable to add an additional step as each additional step will slow the passenger flow. So in a low entry bus, keeping the steps down to the minimum is still a much more optimal outcome than achieving a flat floor, afterall pax here have been standing on buses with even steeper slopes without issues for 3 decades such as the B10M before and after the engine.
Originally posted by SMB1368T:what if its a bendy with 4 doors?
Bendy with 4 or 5 doors are extremely efficient people movers, and major European manufacturers know that. The MAN Lion City G and Mercedes Benz Capacity with their 4 or 5 door options are introduced to meet the demands of public transport networks with extremely high demand. This allows public transport systems and road networks to keep moving due to the unbeatable short dwelling times.
In Latin America, bendy buses and bi-articulated buses with 4 or 5 doors are used on BRTs for the same reason and also as a cheaper alternative to building expensive rail networks.
Originally posted by SMB128B:No as in the CHASSIS leaves little room for modification...
Actually, if you are referring to the Enviro 500 mock up with 3 doors, it doesn't have an engine yet, so in practical terms, the Enviro 500 chassis is as inflexible as the B9TL.
Of course they could develop the 3rd door Enviro 500, but at what cost? If the costs are too high, might as well buy a normal 12m 2 door double deck, or if you really need the efficiency of clearing loads, buy more bendy buses like what the Europeans have done, which in fact will clear loads faster than the 3 door Enviro 500.
Both options mentioned above, ie normal 12m or bendies, are expected to be much cheaper than buying the 3 door Enviro 500. This focus on cost is crucial as it is now the taxpayers who are paying for buses instead of bus companies. The LTA needs to weigh the ROI on a hypothetical purchase of an Enviro 500 3 door vs normal 12m DD vs MAN 3 door DD vs bendy buses carefully, so that taxpayers and commuters get the best solution at a reasonable price.
Originally posted by SMB128B:Then AT LEAST shift the rear door to the back... Not chuck it in the middle...
Wait for you to redesign the chassis.
Originally posted by SBS351M:Actually, if you are referring to the Enviro 500 mock up with 3 doors, it doesn't have an engine yet, so in practical terms, the Enviro 500 chassis is as inflexible as the B9TL.
Of course they could develop the 3rd door Enviro 500, but at what cost? If the costs are too high, might as well buy a normal 12m 2 door double deck, or if you really need the efficiency of clearing loads, buy more bendy buses like what the Europeans have done, which in fact will clear loads faster than the 3 door Enviro 500.
Both options mentioned above, ie normal 12m or bendies, are expected to be much cheaper than buying the 3 door Enviro 500. This focus on cost is crucial as it is now the taxpayers who are paying for buses instead of bus companies. The LTA needs to weigh the ROI on a hypothetical purchase of an Enviro 500 3 door vs normal 12m DD vs MAN 3 door DD vs bendy buses carefully, so that taxpayers and commuters get the best solution at a reasonable price.
Volvo does offer less versatility than ADL... Everywhere the B9 is abt the same, unlike the E500... My observation la at least
I think a 3-door ADL will still be beneficial... Esp with LTA gradually phasing out bendies, 2-door DDs rly cannot cope w feeder load la very frankly, passengers are paying, in the long run, efficiency, convenience and comfort, so why not?
If they DO wanna save money maybe they can do away with the USB ports...
So much marketing gimicks.
Originally posted by SMB128B:Volvo does offer less versatility than ADL... Everywhere the B9 is abt the same, unlike the E500... My observation la at least
I think a 3-door ADL will still be beneficial... Esp with LTA gradually phasing out bendies, 2-door DDs rly cannot cope w feeder load la very frankly, passengers are paying, in the long run, efficiency, convenience and comfort, so why not?
If they DO wanna save money maybe they can do away with the USB ports...
If they dare spam rigids on some svc that cannot tank, good luck.
Originally posted by SMB128B:Volvo does offer less versatility than ADL... Everywhere the B9 is abt the same, unlike the E500... My observation la at least
I think a 3-door ADL will still be beneficial... Esp with LTA gradually phasing out bendies, 2-door DDs rly cannot cope w feeder load la very frankly, passengers are paying, in the long run, efficiency, convenience and comfort, so why not?
If they DO wanna save money maybe they can do away with the USB ports...
Well the B9TL is indeed more versatile. It is available in 2 and 3 axle versions which the Enviro 500 can't, ADL knows it cannot provide for both markets with the same product and hence they had to have two different products, one a 2 axle with a transversely mounted engine, called the Enviro 400, and the other, the 3 axle Enviro 500 with a longidutinally mounted engine. The B9TL however, has the same transverse engine arrangement at the back for both the 2 and 3 axle versions.
So Volvo basically has 1 product that covers what ADL needs 2 products to cover, just shows you how versatile the B9TL is.
Originally posted by SBS351M:Well the B9TL is indeed more versatile. It is available in 2 and 3 axle versions which the Enviro 500 can't, ADL knows it cannot provide for both markets with the same product and hence they had to have two different products, one a 2 axle with a transversely mounted engine, called the Enviro 400, and the other, the 3 axle Enviro 500 with a longidutinally mounted engine. The B9TL however, has the same transverse engine arrangement at the back for both the 2 and 3 axle versions.
So Volvo basically has 1 product that covers what ADL needs 2 products to cover, just shows you how versatile the B9TL is.
Volvo need more power and torque to compete with E500 340hp/1500nm & A95 320hp/1600nm..
Originally posted by lemon1974:Frankly speaking, there is no need for 3 doors SD. Less seatings n the last door won't benefit much ppl. Ppl seated near the middle door will likely to exit from the middle exit. No of standees at the rear is usually less than 10. N that step is so high. (Look similar to those private PPSS or CDS buses). You won't be able to exit fast also because of the high steps
DD with 3rd door will be fine though.
I don't think the reason of adding a 3rd door on SD is to allow fast alighting, but rather drawing the people to move to the rear.
But nevertheless, I think if LTA would to introduce more Low Entry buses, there won't be much issue.
I think so far, the best interior is still the Dennis Lance. Flat and simple(no steep slope bla bla). Sadly it's not wheelchair accessible.
Originally posted by TIB429E:I think so far, the best interior is still the Dennis Lance. Flat and simple(no steep slope bla bla). Sadly it's not wheelchair accessible.
There is the Lance SLF.
But ADL had another SD product which could have really satisifed the 3 door requirement. Unfortunately it was 2003 and the bus was too ahead of its time (13 years to be precise):
http://autonews.uk.com/the-bus-that-never-was/
Interior: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-q6xSY1gm-jw/UXTU4Dmu96I/AAAAAAAABq4/58zgdxRbQz0/s1600/P1060417.JPG
I am not sure if ADL is willing to revive this idea but this will give ADL a fighting chance against STK/MAN/GML if LTA decides to combine the production SD and DD three door bus tender.
STK MAN easily can win this can contract.
MAN should design 3 doors SD with 12.2m chassis..Rear just add 1 step..No need to make so high like coach...I welcome three door SD with more than 12m.
Didnt know that LTA was actl so interested in the tri-door A22, that they trialled it tgt with the A95
I hope this bus gets deployed on high-demand short haul e.g. 913
Originally posted by SMB128B:Didnt know that LTA was actl so interested in the tri-door A22, that they trialled it tgt with the A95
I hope this bus gets deployed on high-demand short haul e.g. 913
What about Volvo B8L 12.8m 3 doors and MB Citaro 3 doors with no PIS and SBST colour scheme?🤣
Originally posted by carbikebus:What about Volvo B8L 12.8m 3 doors and MB Citaro 3 doors with no PIS and SBST colour scheme?藍
Very funny hor
seem to have only 27 seats compare to 35/38 for normal A22 and out of these 27 seats, around 10 are priority seats...
Originally posted by SMB128B:Didnt know that LTA was actl so interested in the tri-door A22, that they trialled it tgt with the A95
I hope this bus gets deployed on high-demand short haul e.g. 913
913? so deploying one bus every one minute?
Originally posted by SMB128B:Didnt know that LTA was actl so interested in the tri-door A22, that they trialled it tgt with the A95
I hope this bus gets deployed on high-demand short haul e.g. 913
LTA said that they would evaluate both the buses on routes that pass by both the city and residential areas.
I find this perplexing. There is still time but they should also evaluate both of these buses on feeders and intratowns/town links, since these buses are likely to substitute bendy buses in the long term.
It is a waste of time and money if they test these two buses on routes like 143 and 190 where normal 2 door buses work well. It is the feeders and intra towns/townlinks that are more in need of these!
190 always gets these new buses. Even A22s and A24s.
Originally posted by SMB128B:Didnt know that LTA was actl so interested in the tri-door A22, that they trialled it tgt with the A95
I hope this bus gets deployed on high-demand short haul e.g. 913
Try deploy on 913 during morning peak hour ... see how useless/useful the bus is ...
Originally posted by TIB987K:Try deploy on 913 during morning peak hour ... see how useless/useful the bus is ...
whether it is useful for those paxes alighing at admiralty mrt station, we shall wait and see.
but we can see the no of paxes left behind at the previous bus stops...when such 3 door A22 are deploy on 913/903/912 etc etc...
Nice one !
