Loading level on buses (Part 2)

• BusAnalayzer

  5 Apr 16, 18:39

  Originally posted by gekpohboy:

  The problem is that during peak hours, there's a lot of people, that it is very hard to count, especially at bus stops with many people alighting and/or boarding, especially if the bus is a double decker - like how are you going to move around up and down to check whether the total number is correct.

  I feel that the loading pattern is the same across the day. While it is easier to count during non-peak hours, I can get an idea on the origins and destinations that are popular along the bus route. To get an idea of the peak hour loading, I "multiply" the non-peak hours loading - it's as simple as that; if during non-peak hours the bus already has up to forty people, then it's quite likely that during peak hour the bus would have around eighty people (full load on single decker, 60% load on double decker).

  Totally wrong. Off peak you will always have low loading. You cannot then say x service needs upgrade or downgrade.

  Loading observation is matter of practice. If you are on DD, try to take bus from first stop. 

  (1) When you are in queue, try to be in the front of queue and count upto 20 pax behind you and note the 20th person

  (2) Get into the bus and quickly go to the top and take the window seat in row 1 or row 5. These are the two best spots for loading

  (3) Continue counting where you left from the 20th person

  (4) Now every stop monitor how many get out and get in

  (5) Stops of high volume, you will have to quickly count 20 pax trying to enter in and then focus on those alighting. My experience says you are +- 5 pax inaccurate, not more

  (6) If you aren't good at it, just count pax on upper deck and go to lower deck and count. You get your total. Then take the high seat on lower deck and you can count pax entering and leaving the bus

• SBS3004X

  5 Apr 16, 19:17

  Service 116 Off-peak 4.15 pm

  SBS8189M was packed to door on PM Split first trip returning to Hougang.

• array88

  5 Apr 16, 23:18

  Originally posted by BusAnalayzer:

  Your loading analysis is kind of useless if you don't do it during peak hours. This is because you will never understand the true utilitiy of a service if you joyride off peak. sv 25 has packed buses during peak hours which is 7-830am in both directions in AM. PM peak is from 5-630pm.

  While I do agree that off-peak loading is not the best indicator of the value of a service, I still appreciate gekpohboy's effort to take the buses and record down observations, especially since it seems that he deliberately went to take 25 just for this.

  Moreover, his loadings do provide some interesting observations on loading patterns (not just magnitudes). E.g. AMK - Blk 554, AMK/HG - Eunos Link, Kembangan - Chai Chee Ind Pk.  IMO this is a different point from just saying that "svc 25 DDs are packed during peak hours".

   

• array88

  5 Apr 16, 23:21

  Originally posted by gekpohboy:

  Bus Service 25

  Direction 2 - Bedok to Ang Mo Kio.

  4 April 2016 (Monday)

  Trip started at 10:10am, ended at 11:05am.

  1. Bedok Int: + 12 - 0 (12)
  2. Opp Blk 32: + 3 - 1 (14)
  3. Opp Chai Chee Ind Pk: + 5 - 0 (19)
  4. Aft Perpetual Succour Ch: + 0 - 0 (19)
  5. Bef Siglap Plain: + 0 - 0 (19)
  6. Mjd Kassim: + 0 - 0 (19)
  7. Bef Lor 110 Changi: + 1 - 0 (20)
  8. Eunos Stn: + 6 - 5 (21)
  9. Blk 17: + 3 - 0 (24)
  10. Blk 322: + 0 - 2 (22)
  11. Blk 311: + 8 - 0 (30)
  12. Opp Eunos Technolink: + 1 - 3 (28)
  13. Comfort Driving Ctr: + 3 - 5 (26)
  14. Aft Airport Rd: + 0 - 2 (24)
  15. Bef Kim Chuan Rd: + 0 - 0 (24)
  16. Opp SBST Hougang Depot: + 1 - 0 (25)
  17. Opp S'pore Girls' Home: + 0 - 0 (25)
  18. Blk 172: + 5 - 0 (30)
  19. Blk 106: + 4 - 1 (33)
  20. Blk 241: + 0 - 0 (33)
  21. Blk 248: + 1 - 0 (34)
  22. Blk 21: + 3 - 4 (33)
  23. Blk 708: + 2 - 2 (33)
  24. Opp Blk 615: + 1 - 1 (33)
  25. Opp Blk 627: + 0 - 0 (33)
  26. Opp Blk 634: + 1 - 2 (32)
  27. Blk 151: + 2 - 5 (29)
  28. Blk 101: + 6 - 2 (33)
  29. Opp Daikin S'pore: + 1 - 0 (34)
  30. Opp Blk 5022: + 0 - 0 (34)
  31. Opp Blk 565: + 2 - 2 (34)
  32. Blk 452: + 7 - 2 (39)
  33. Blk 427: + 2 - 0 (41)
  34. Opp Ang Mo Kio Stn: + 0 - 8 (33)
  35. Ang Mo Kio Int: + 0 - 33 (0)

  I am surprised that there is no abrupt change in loading. It seems that most people are heading to the same destination: Ang Mo Kio Bus Interchange. It seems that quite a number of people take bus 25 all the way from Bedok Bus Interchange to Ang Mo Kio Bus Interchange.

  Anyway,

  Most people board at "Bedok Int" (12), "Blk 311" (8) and "Blk 452" (7). Actually, besides Bedok Bus Interchange, the boarding activity at all bus stops is about the same.

  Most people alight at "Ang Mo Kio Int" (33), "Opp Ang Mo Kio Stn" (8), "Comfort Driving Ctr" (5) and "Blk 151" (5). Similarly, besides Ang Mo Kio Bus Interchange, the alighting activity at all bus stops is about the same.

  Unfortunately, loading patterns during peak and off-peak DO differ a lot. Especially for industrial and CBD services, you can have full buses during peak hours but empty buses during non-peak.

  In addition, just because there's no abrupt change in the total number of pax onboard the bus, it doesn't mean that they're all heading to Ang Mo Kio. If you notice, the turnover rate according to your loading analysis is quite high. Which means that by the time that bus reached let's say Hougang Ave 3, those who boarded at Bedok might have already alighted.

• gekpohboy

  5 Apr 16, 23:25

  errr... okay.

  points noted.

  thanks for the feedback.

  good night.

  ehh... ji bai sia.

  Singapore got less than one thousand public bus routes, right?

  then why after around two thousand one hundred and eighty threads on, we still have not analysed all the bus routes in Singapore?

  If we are not so particular about timing, location and type, but only analyse the loading, actually I think by now all bus routes would have been covered already lor.

  sorry.

• gekpohboy

  6 Apr 16, 00:09

  Originally posted by array88:

  Unfortunately, loading patterns during peak and off-peak DO differ a lot. Especially for industrial and CBD services, you can have full buses during peak hours but empty buses during non-peak.

  In addition, just because there's no abrupt change in the total number of pax onboard the bus, it doesn't mean that they're all heading to Ang Mo Kio. If you notice, the turnover rate according to your loading analysis is quite high. Which means that by the time that bus reached let's say Hougang Ave 3, those who boarded at Bedok might have already alighted.

  Perhaps I should add that when I was recording that ride, most of the passengers were elderly people, or old people... I felt so young, even though I am already twenty years old. Haha. -no offences-

• BusAnalayzer

  6 Apr 16, 10:03

  Originally posted by array88:

  While I do agree that off-peak loading is not the best indicator of the value of a service, I still appreciate gekpohboy's effort to take the buses and record down observations, especially since it seems that he deliberately went to take 25 just for this.

  Moreover, his loadings do provide some interesting observations on loading patterns (not just magnitudes). E.g. AMK - Blk 554, AMK/HG - Eunos Link, Kembangan - Chai Chee Ind Pk.  IMO this is a different point from just saying that "svc 25 DDs are packed during peak hours".

   

  That's fine. You can do loading analysis at any time. Then just dont make comments on fleet deployment based on what you notice off-peak. Totally irrelevant. If you want to make comments about frequency increase during off-peak, then that's logical. What i have seen is people take buses off-peak and then ask why DD is deployed on the service or make comments like frequency is pathetic. 

• BusAnalayzer

  7 Apr 16, 14:51

  Loading on sv 76 @ 17.40 from Eunos Interchange

  Eunos Interchange -- 12 (0/12)

  Jalan Ubi -- 14 (0/2)

  Geylang Road -- 18 (-6/10), 22 (-4/8)

  Paya Lebar Road -- 20 (-4/2), 22 (-2/4), 26 (0/4), 30 (-2/6), 41 (0/11), 52 (-3/14), 65 (-7/20) Tai Seng MRT, 72 (-2/9), 75 (-2/5)

  Upper Paya Lebar Road -- 78 (-2/5), 78 (-2/2), 77 (-1/0), 78 (-1/2), 77 (-5/4)

  Boundary Road -- 79 (-1/3)

  YCK Road -- 80 (-4/5), 78 (-2/0), 75 (-5/2), 72 (-6/3), 71 (-4/3)

  AMK Ave 3 -- 72 (-9/10), 68 (-14/10), 71 (0/3), 74 (-1/4), 70 (-6/2), 67 (-6/3), 66 (-3/2), 59 (-22/15), 50 (-17/9), 50 (-2/2), 49 (-3/2)

  AMK Ave 4 -- 44 (-8/3), 38 (-11/5), 33 (-11/6), 30 (-10/7), 20 (-16/6)

  AMK Ave 9 -- 18 (-4/2)

  YCK Interchange -- 00 (-18/0)

  * No standee throughout the route, but good 70-80 pax from Paya Lebar to AMK MRT.

  * Lot of long distance travelers. Upper deck 90-100% full throughout the Paya Lebar - AMK sector

  * Bus in front = 13 mins, Bus behind = 12 mins.

  * Eunos - Paya Lebar sector is redundant

  * AMK MRT - AMK Ave 4 have other services that could impact the loading. Loading was lesser than expected from AMK MRT but could be because people prefer 269/269A from interchange that comes at 04-06 mins frequency. 

  * Guess these people on Paya Lebar-AMK sector would be very happy with regular 76 arrival from Eunos. Would have still preferred if 76 could have diverted to Lor1 Geylang instead.

• BusAnalayzer

  8 Apr 16, 13:43

  76 is doing very well these days in Paya Lebar sector back home to YCK.

  134 also catching up quite well. Each bus during peak hours is getting 50-60 pax range from Paya Lebar MRT. Some more, can always see 8-12 pax taking 134 beyond Paya Lebar MRT. 

• SBS8002T

  13 Apr 16, 10:27

  SBS3121R 242, boarding time 3:20pm on 8 Apr 2016 (first afternoon/evening DD trip)

  
  

  BNL - 27

  Blk 683A - 27

  Blk 680C - 26 (-1)

  Blk 676B - 26

  Blk 673C - 25 (+1/-2)

  West Grove Pri - 18 (+1/-8)

  Blk 729 - 16 (-2)

  Blk 715 - 7 (+3/-12)

  Blk 711 - 6 (-1, I alighted here)

  
  

  I did this loading to observe the alighting patterns of commuters during the afternoon/evening period, many passangers alighted at St72 and Avenue 5 during my loading analysis. 242's frequency is quite good though I suggest re-routing 258 to serve Street 72 and Avenue 5

  
  

  This is posted sometimes back by me:

  Joo Koon Int follow original route to Street 61, turn to Avenue 4 (towards West Grove Pri), turn into Street 72 and follow 242's route until Blk 711 before following original route back to Joo Koon.

  
  

  Notes: 3121R slot is NWAB according to SBST timetable
• SBS 9256 X

  13 Apr 16, 10:39

  Originally posted by BusAnalayzer:

  Loading on sv 76 @ 17.40 from Eunos Interchange

  Eunos Interchange -- 12 (0/12)

  Jalan Ubi -- 14 (0/2)

  Geylang Road -- 18 (-6/10), 22 (-4/8)

  Paya Lebar Road -- 20 (-4/2), 22 (-2/4), 26 (0/4), 30 (-2/6), 41 (0/11), 52 (-3/14), 65 (-7/20) Tai Seng MRT, 72 (-2/9), 75 (-2/5)

  Upper Paya Lebar Road -- 78 (-2/5), 78 (-2/2), 77 (-1/0), 78 (-1/2), 77 (-5/4)

  Boundary Road -- 79 (-1/3)

  YCK Road -- 80 (-4/5), 78 (-2/0), 75 (-5/2), 72 (-6/3), 71 (-4/3)

  AMK Ave 3 -- 72 (-9/10), 68 (-14/10), 71 (0/3), 74 (-1/4), 70 (-6/2), 67 (-6/3), 66 (-3/2), 59 (-22/15), 50 (-17/9), 50 (-2/2), 49 (-3/2)

  AMK Ave 4 -- 44 (-8/3), 38 (-11/5), 33 (-11/6), 30 (-10/7), 20 (-16/6)

  AMK Ave 9 -- 18 (-4/2)

  YCK Interchange -- 00 (-18/0)

  * No standee throughout the route, but good 70-80 pax from Paya Lebar to AMK MRT.

  * Lot of long distance travelers. Upper deck 90-100% full throughout the Paya Lebar - AMK sector

  * Bus in front = 13 mins, Bus behind = 12 mins.

  * Eunos - Paya Lebar sector is redundant

  * AMK MRT - AMK Ave 4 have other services that could impact the loading. Loading was lesser than expected from AMK MRT but could be because people prefer 269/269A from interchange that comes at 04-06 mins frequency. 

  * Guess these people on Paya Lebar-AMK sector would be very happy with regular 76 arrival from Eunos. Would have still preferred if 76 could have diverted to Lor1 Geylang instead.

  The Paya Lebar stretch, I think that this service is serve as an alternative besides Svc 22 & 24.. It is also depending on whether the two buses are in front of Svc 76. I know Svc 22 can have long waiting time together with svc 24.

  I waited for Svc 24 before from Geylang Road... Maybe about 15 mins, one bus then come and subsequent bus just drive by about 2 mins later...

  I may have to disagree with your statement of the "Eunos - Paya Lebar sector redundant".

• SBS 9256 X

  13 Apr 16, 10:46

  Svc 811 Loading quite impressive for today... However, I need to scream to ask the passengers to move in coz there are passengers wanting to get on the bus...

  Do they prefer to take 811 rather than crossing the road to take 117 along Ave 1?

• array88

  13 Apr 16, 11:06

  Originally posted by SBS 9256 X:

  The Paya Lebar stretch, I think that this service is serve as an alternative besides Svc 22 & 24.. It is also depending on whether the two buses are in front of Svc 76. I know Svc 22 can have long waiting time together with svc 24.

  I waited for Svc 24 before from Geylang Road... Maybe about 15 mins, one bus then come and subsequent bus just drive by about 2 mins later...

  I may have to disagree with your statement of the "Eunos - Paya Lebar sector redundant".

  Do note that: 

  (1) There's 154 in parallel from Eunos Int to MacPherson estate junction, and 155 in parallel to Paya Lebar MRT

  (2) At least during off-peak, those taking 76 from Eunos Int and Geylang Rd usually do not travel beyond Paya Lebar MRT (although I do expect slightly more people traveling to Tai Seng / Serangoon during peak)

• SBS 9256 X

  13 Apr 16, 11:16

  Originally posted by array88:

  Do note that: 

  (1) There's 154 in parallel from Eunos Int to MacPherson estate junction, and 155 in parallel to Paya Lebar MRT

  (2) At least during off-peak, those taking 76 from Eunos Int and Geylang Rd usually do not travel beyond Paya Lebar MRT (although I do expect slightly more people traveling to Tai Seng / Serangoon during peak)

  Oops... I forgot of Svc 154 from Eunos to Macpherson...

  Yeah, I agree with point 2.. I think by night nt many... Just wait till fasting month, then the crowd come...

• BusAnalayzer

  13 Apr 16, 12:47

  Originally posted by SBS 9256 X:

  Svc 811 Loading quite impressive for today... However, I need to scream to ask the passengers to move in coz there are passengers wanting to get on the bus...

  Do they prefer to take 811 rather than crossing the road to take 117 along Ave 1?

  You may ride a DD soon on 811. Are you getting trained on DD?

• SMB3095S

  13 Apr 16, 13:14

  Originally posted by BusAnalayzer:

  You may ride a DD soon on 811. Are you getting trained on DD?

  Since there is a DD trained on 811 route, it will be possible for 811 to get DDs soon

• SBS 9256 X

  13 Apr 16, 13:44

  Originally posted by BusAnalayzer:

  You may ride a DD soon on 811. Are you getting trained on DD?

  Hahas, I'm not a service captain.. I am a passenger who would scream to move behind...

• BusAnalayzer

  13 Apr 16, 14:54

  Originally posted by SBS 9256 X:

  Hahas, I'm not a service captain.. I am a passenger who would scream to move behind...

  Oh ok... you wrote as if you were the BC on ths bus... Sorry about that 

• SBS 9256 X

  13 Apr 16, 16:01

  Originally posted by BusAnalayzer:

  Oh ok... you wrote as if you were the BC on ths bus... Sorry about that 

  Its okay... Actually, they should put the DDs on 860 first!!! This bus desperately need the fleet upgrade and with Bendies should be fine...

  Maybe order of arrangement goes like this...

  DD - Rigid - Bendy - Rigid - Rigid - DD - Bendy - Rigid - Rigid - Bendy  - Rigid - Rigid - Bendy - DD/Rigid

   

• BusAnalayzer

  13 Apr 16, 19:32

  Originally posted by SBS 9256 X:

  Its okay... Actually, they should put the DDs on 860 first!!! This bus desperately need the fleet upgrade and with Bendies should be fine...

  Maybe order of arrangement goes like this...

  DD - Rigid - Bendy - Rigid - Rigid - DD - Bendy - Rigid - Rigid - Bendy  - Rigid - Rigid - Bendy - DD/Rigid

   

  When I had observed 860 in Jan & Feb, loading was okay. 50-60 pax during AM and 30-40 pax during PM as it is more spread out. The frequency is superb with bus every 03-05 mins. Bunching extremely common. 

  860 didn't need 16 buses... what it needed was 6 DDs, 6 SDs... and that would have done the job... or 6 Bendies, 6 SDs.. but since it spammed 16 buses... there is really no need of more HC buses (as of Feb). Unless the loading has dramatically gone up in the last 1 month.

• SBS8002T

  13 Apr 16, 22:24

  Are there any tips for counting passangers on a B10M/citaro/A22? For KUB, I tend to sit at the backmost seats where I can see the alighting and boarding passangers and I sit on the left side front row seats on the upper deck for DD.

• BusAnalayzer

  14 Apr 16, 14:43

  Originally posted by SBS8002T:

  Are there any tips for counting passangers on a B10M/citaro/A22? For KUB, I tend to sit at the backmost seats where I can see the alighting and boarding passangers and I sit on the left side front row seats on the upper deck for DD.

  For B10M, sit in front of the exit door. It is easiest to see people board and from corner of your eye, count alighting pax. Pretty accurate. Another alternative is in the seat next to the door (opp to door). 

  For Citaro, I usually sit at the 4 seat facing the door. Quite okay to count. A22 is same as KUB.

• Sbs6750E

  14 Apr 16, 19:02

  Just a tip for counting pax inside bendy: Sit at the back of the second door. Haven't tried it personally, but I will when I am lucky enough to catch a bendy this Sunday because I'm going to go Jurong Kechil. What svc there got bendy?
• array88

  14 Apr 16, 19:57

  Has 85's loading been affected by 102/117?

• BusAnalayzer

  15 Apr 16, 16:10

  Originally posted by array88:

  Has 85's loading been affected by 102/117?

  Not really. Loading hasn't picked up nor gone down. This is because of the surge of flats in Compassalve / Sengkang East / Sengkang West. Most buses still get around 50-60 pax. Seldom more than that so the DDs are a little under utilized but not too bad la.