Bring back the era of express bus services!
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Originally posted by carbikebus:
Shouldnt public transport purpose is to serve public and profit is secondary?
Public or private, the dough has to come from somewhere. The Government is already paying it with BSEP, but I have doubts that tax rates will stay the same.
In any case, the illustration aims to serve as an indicator of the true cost of an express bus service. It's the reason why private bus operators could not even step in to provide anything more than peak hour premium bus services or fixed-schedule shuttles at double the PT fare, because the sums don't add up.
That being said, improving all-day connectivity and augmenting capacity of existing routes must remain as the primary goal of our planners, because that is where a public good benefits the greatest number of people in the society. We have unlimited wants, but limited resources to bear; between using buses to reduce commuting times to what the MRT can achieve and bringing the first bus service to a new estate, I will choose the latter.
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Lol why must my future generation suffer?
Anyway to cut long story short i just need 513 to run full day ala 518 style,Is it too much to ask for?
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Originally posted by ^tamago^:
Public or private, the dough has to come from somewhere. The Government is already paying it with BSEP, but I have doubts that tax rates will stay the same. Your future generation will suffer, unless you do not have ownership of the place and have a safe house elsewhere.
In any case, the illustration aims to serve as an indicator of the true cost of an express bus service. It's the reason why private bus operators could not even step in to provide anything more than peak hour premium bus services or fixed-schedule shuttles at double the PT fare, because the sums don't add up.
some time back, when the government announced the fare adjustments for this year 2015, I also have such thoughts about transport fares.at the end of the day, if the costs of operation increases, we have to pay more money for it. even if the transport fares are lowered, there will be other components that will increase. For instance, tax.
if so, why not just increase the transport fares - while lower the corresponding component in the tax?
why are we benefiting the foreigners and the tourists who do not have to pay tax, but just have to pay the low transport fares? why not just take away the transport component in the tax and raise transport fares instead? it's still the same, right?
not only is it the same, it is more fair/equal this way, because everyone who takes our public transport will pay the same price for it.
if the foreigners and tourists also chip in, we locals can even end up paying less for public transport. think about it.
so, why not just increase the public transport fares to cover the costs of operating our public transport?
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meanwhile, there is hope that the operating costs of buses will be lowered significantly, when the Government Contracting Model is implemented for our public bus services, as the Government strives to derive the best value for money solutions to operate our public bus services.
when the operating costs is lowered, fares will be lowered.
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Originally posted by JurongWestresident:
some time back, when the government announced the fare adjustments for this year 2015, I also have such thoughts about transport fares.at the end of the day, if the costs of operation increases, we have to pay more money for it. even if the transport fares are lowered, there will be other components that will increase. For instance, tax.
if so, why not just increase the transport fares - while lower the corresponding component in the tax?
why are we benefiting the foreigners and the tourists who do not have to pay tax, but just have to pay the low transport fares? why not just take away the transport component in the tax and raise transport fares instead? it's still the same, right?
not only is it the same, it is more fair/equal this way, because everyone who takes our public transport will pay the same price for it.
if the foreigners and tourists also chip in, we locals can even end up paying less for public transport. think about it.
so, why not just increase the public transport fares to cover the costs of operating our public transport?
Well, I think one reason why the Government is not relying solely on transport fares, is to help the lower income people. this is related to "Progressive tax", whereby the poor pay less tax, while the rich pay more tax.
I'm not good in Economics, so I rather not write about it. Sorry.
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Originally posted by carbikebus:
Lol why must my future generation suffer?
Anyway to cut long story short i just need 513 to run full day ala 518 style,Is it too much to ask for?
By paying higher tax rates to meet the shortfall between the cost of operations and politically correct revenue on a recurring basis. There may not always be a shortfall, but I think the chances that a shortfall is higher, either due to inflation from a booming economy and/or resistance to any upward revision in fares.
You could try writing in to the planners at LTA. But how many people actually need to commute from a few neighbourhoods in Tampines to the offices in Shenton Way in the middle of the day? Or did you mean a 513M for Orchard Road and Marina Bay during off-peak hours and on weekends?
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Originally posted by ^tamago^:
By paying higher tax rates to meet the shortfall between the cost of operations and politically correct revenue on a recurring basis. There may not always be a shortfall, but I think the chances that a shortfall is higher, either due to inflation from a booming economy and/or resistance to any upward revision in fares.
You could try writing in to the planners at LTA. But how many people actually need to commute from a few neighbourhoods in Tampines to the offices in Shenton Way in the middle of the day?
alternatively, as what has been suggested previously, we could have some bus services operate only during peak periods, and in only one direction.
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Originally posted by JurongWestresident:
meanwhile, there is hope that the operating costs of buses will be lowered significantly, when the Government Contracting Model is implemented for our public bus services, as the Government strives to derive the best value for money solutions to operate our public bus services.
when the operating costs is lowered, fares will be lowered.
We will know whether this is true once the results for the first parcel tender is released.
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Originally posted by ^tamago^:
You could try writing in to the planners at LTA. But how many people actually need to commute from a few neighbourhoods in Tampines to the offices in Shenton Way in the middle of the day? Or did you mean a 513M for Orchard Road and Marina Bay during off-peak hours and on weekends?
And there was SBS Transit's CityShopper, which was largely based on this concept.
There was insufficient patronage to sustain these services.
The last set of changes to SBS Transit Express services (removing the B suffix) suggest the fall in demand for point-to-point services.
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Originally posted by JurongWestresident:
alternatively, as what has been suggested previously, we could have some bus services operate only during peak periods, and in only one direction.
It currently exists. It's called City Direct.
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Originally posted by ^tamago^:
By paying higher tax rates to meet the shortfall between the cost of operations and politically correct revenue on a recurring basis. There may not always be a shortfall, but I think the chances that a shortfall is higher, either due to inflation from a booming economy and/or resistance to any upward revision in fares.
You could try writing in to the planners at LTA. But how many people actually need to commute from a few neighbourhoods in Tampines to the offices in Shenton Way in the middle of the day? Or did you mean a 513M for Orchard Road and Marina Bay during off-peak hours and on weekends?
There is already 518 for that purpose already.
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Originally posted by ^tamago^:
By paying higher tax rates to meet the shortfall between the cost of operations and politically correct revenue on a recurring basis. There may not always be a shortfall, but I think the chances that a shortfall is higher, either due to inflation from a booming economy and/or resistance to any upward revision in fares.
You could try writing in to the planners at LTA. But how many people actually need to commute from a few neighbourhoods in Tampines to the offices in Shenton Way in the middle of the day? Or did you mean a 513M for Orchard Road and Marina Bay during off-peak hours and on weekends?
My friends(usually those driving in the cbd) rely on 513 as an alternative to get to office to save the hassle of squeezing inside MRT.Even some neighbours i knew around my area also support the extension hours or at least run 3 PM trips from CBD.Weekends they heck care cause they will use their cars anyway..As for myself i ride my 750cc bike to work and use my 7 seater MPV during my off days or weekends.Once a while then i will take bus or MRT
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u mean no more 543?
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Originally posted by carbikebus:
My friends(usually those driving in the cbd) rely on 513 as an alternative to get to office to save the hassle of squeezing inside MRT.Even some neighbours i knew around my area also support the extension hours or at least run 3 PM trips from CBD.Weekends they heck care cause they will use their cars anyway..As for myself i ride my 750cc bike to work and use my 7 seater MPV during my off days or weekends.Once a while then i will take bus or MRT
There's an easy solution to this. Have 518 serve Shenton Way (the same stops as 502 currently serves) before hitting the expressway.
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I think in some way focus is coming back to express services.
506 and 518 both got upgrades with DDs.
513 has an added bus
850E and 951E are getting upgraded with more DDs by months passing
There is need to upgrade Express (Fast Forward services)
10E is the only DD service though even other services need DDs
30E should have 2 SDs --> DD
196E should have 2 SDs --> DD
14E should have its Orchard touch 8.30am service as DD
* All the above services need DDs for its slot reaching CBD between 8.20 and 8.30am - bus is totally packed to door and sure many could not board.
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10E should get one more DD. It is okay if not fleet add, but can be crossover from sv 10 as buses in opposite direction to Tampines are quite empty.
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Originally posted by carbikebus:
My friends(usually those driving in the cbd) rely on 513 as an alternative to get to office to save the hassle of squeezing inside MRT.Even some neighbours i knew around my area also support the extension hours or at least run 3 PM trips from CBD.Weekends they heck care cause they will use their cars anyway..As for myself i ride my 750cc bike to work and use my 7 seater MPV during my off days or weekends.Once a while then i will take bus or MRT
If there is growth in ridership in the evening trips for 513, I would see no reason why they won't add a bus. But if you make 513 operate on a whole day basis, 518 could end up being withdrawn due to low ridership, especially after DTL comes onboard.
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Originally posted by sgbuses:
For express services to be feasible full day, you must be able to read timetables and tell the difference between prefixes/suffixes. This is an example used in Adelaide.
Operating hourly services may be a more feasible plan with a published timetable.
Singapore's bus operations are very simplified due to its frequency. In other countries, it is not unusual for a particular bus duty to operate more than 5 routes in a single day. This is to allow maximization of resources by reducing the layover time at the interchange where bus services are not as frequent.
SGreans are not tt capable of understanding prefixes/suffixes...
Till date, still ve passengers asking 36B BC if bus going to Suntec...
KMB 51 runs at 60min interval off peak -
518 off peak morning weekdays there s less than 10 passengers twds PSR
Same goes for Sat, Sun, PH mornings n weekday early afternoon, sometimes DD zoom past ECP with around 8 pax...
30e, 196e is operator service, wrote to LTA before, its not trunk bus, operator has a right to dcide type of bus, not under LTA purview
btw there s a reason for not introducing DDs on 30e/196e, it is the already high loading of this two trunk services...
10E is more than adequate coz trunk 10 runs very regularly after 0800hrs, Mountbatten Rd(Katong S C) as reference...
Wrote to SBST/LTA prev for 3 10S which starts from Kent Ridge(morning peak) looping opp Temasek School(UEC) n start svc aft Temasek School bs for faster turn around, no go -
Agree with Tamago, mindless pumping in of buses will result in higher fares for all
It is already happening and will get worst with bus contracting model... -
543 still alive and running
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518 actually no need to winding up along Pasir Ris area..
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Originally posted by Acx1688:
Agree with Tamago, mindless pumping in of buses will result in higher fares for all
It is already happening and will get worst with bus contracting model...Payment based on milage clocked, independent of patronage is a very poor idea.
The result may be operators skipping bus stops or/and refusing to pick up passengers to make up time if their buses are late.
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Originally posted by sgbuses:
It already exists...it's called 188R and 963R. Personally I do use it on occasions where I am late for appointments, even though I am not headed for RWS.
And 290/290A is slower than the MTR:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MYNIjeI83MA
The route is designed more for point to point travel and as a means of convenience of not having to change trains.
Using South TKO, ofc slower....
Personally i would rather 290 coz MTR is unreliable, crowded and required numerous transfers
This says exactly the same for SG... if the time diff isnt huge and it is express, i wld take bus...