Low Floor buses get more complaints than Low Entry buses?
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Originally posted by SMB228X:
Scania are creepy buses always accident, loud radiator, jerking and lousy interior!!! Citaro is the best safest most comfortable and stylish!!!"always accident" Hmm,how is this the buses fault? And besides,it's the most common bus in Singapore.
Oh wow,a loud radiator,I'm pretty sure that will displease the living heck outta ya. That goes for the jerking and the "lousy interior"
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Not wanting to sound biased, I must say that the Citaros are still the best purchase ever made by SBST. The suspension is extremely comfortable and the gearbox is remarkably smooth. The turbo boost that comes on at high revs is exciting as well. True, the aircon's quite weak but blame SBST for not getting the double-glazed windows to keep out the heat. I think the aircon vents were designed to be non-adjustable to prevent pesky commuters from adjusting them to block airflow. I think it also helps with ensuring uniformity as there won't be weird eyeball vents facing in a myriad of different directions. But I must agree they could have designed the aircon better. SBST should have also gotten a 6-speed gearbox or a 4-speed Voith with a higher final drive ratio so that it wouldn't be so loud at 60km/h. It's always intriguing to me how the Germans are so particular on quality but then close one eye to engine noise as evident by how loud the O405s were. I've been to Germany and their older MANs are just as loud, especially the SD202s with their 3-speed gearboxes. Finding a good KUB is like searching for a needle in a haystack. Most of them roar, jerk and seem difficult to control by BCs. There are a few good Euro IVs on 27 though. Their gearboxes are fantastic and radiators totally silent. Unlike the Euro Vs though, there's that jerk when moving off in 1st gear. Most Euro Vs seem to be terribly maintained as many fail to shift up properly and have insanely loud radiators. I wonder how Scania isn't embarrassed to sell such a sub-par quality chassis with the Gemilang bodywork.
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Now I'm starting to think that HK's KUBs are way better... Never took KMB KUBs but took the KMB B7RLE, all of them are better than SGs buses, except those old buses...
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Originally posted by nfshp253:
Not wanting to sound biased, I must say that the Citaros are still the best purchase ever made by SBST. The suspension is extremely comfortable and the gearbox is remarkably smooth. The turbo boost that comes on at high revs is exciting as well. True, the aircon’s quite weak but blame SBST for not getting the double-glazed windows to keep out the heat. I think the aircon vents were designed to be non-adjustable to prevent pesky commuters from adjusting them to block airflow. I think it also helps with ensuring uniformity as there won’t be weird eyeball vents facing in a myriad of different directions. But I must agree they could have designed the aircon better. SBST should have also gotten a 6-speed gearbox or a 4-speed Voith with a higher final drive ratio so that it wouldn’t be so loud at 60km/h. It’s always intriguing to me how the Germans are so particular on quality but then close one eye to engine noise as evident by how loud the O405s were. I’ve been to Germany and their older MANs are just as loud, especially the SD202s with their 3-speed gearboxes.
Finding a good KUB is like searching for a needle in a haystack. Most of them roar, jerk and seem difficult to control by BCs. There are a few good Euro IVs on 27 though. Their gearboxes are fantastic and radiators totally silent. Unlike the Euro Vs though, there’s that jerk when moving off in 1st gear. Most Euro Vs seem to be terribly maintained as many fail to shift up properly and have insanely loud radiators. I wonder how Scania isn’t embarrassed to sell such a sub-par quality chassis with the Gemilang bodywork.
Actually,the suspension and the gearbox is still new,that's why it's considered good..
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Originally posted by nfshp253:
Not wanting to sound biased, I must say that the Citaros are still the best purchase ever made by SBST. The suspension is extremely comfortable and the gearbox is remarkably smooth. The turbo boost that comes on at high revs is exciting as well. True, the aircon’s quite weak but blame SBST for not getting the double-glazed windows to keep out the heat. I think the aircon vents were designed to be non-adjustable to prevent pesky commuters from adjusting them to block airflow. I think it also helps with ensuring uniformity as there won’t be weird eyeball vents facing in a myriad of different directions. But I must agree they could have designed the aircon better. SBST should have also gotten a 6-speed gearbox or a 4-speed Voith with a higher final drive ratio so that it wouldn’t be so loud at 60km/h. It’s always intriguing to me how the Germans are so particular on quality but then close one eye to engine noise as evident by how loud the O405s were. I’ve been to Germany and their older MANs are just as loud, especially the SD202s with their 3-speed gearboxes.
Finding a good KUB is like searching for a needle in a haystack. Most of them roar, jerk and seem difficult to control by BCs. There are a few good Euro IVs on 27 though. Their gearboxes are fantastic and radiators totally silent. Unlike the Euro Vs though, there’s that jerk when moving off in 1st gear. Most Euro Vs seem to be terribly maintained as many fail to shift up properly and have insanely loud radiators. I wonder how Scania isn’t embarrassed to sell such a sub-par quality chassis with the Gemilang bodywork.
I have found that needle from the haystack :D
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Originally posted by nfshp253:
Not wanting to sound biased, I must say that the Citaros are still the best purchase ever made by SBST. The suspension is extremely comfortable and the gearbox is remarkably smooth. The turbo boost that comes on at high revs is exciting as well. True, the aircon’s quite weak but blame SBST for not getting the double-glazed windows to keep out the heat. I think the aircon vents were designed to be non-adjustable to prevent pesky commuters from adjusting them to block airflow. I think it also helps with ensuring uniformity as there won’t be weird eyeball vents facing in a myriad of different directions. But I must agree they could have designed the aircon better. SBST should have also gotten a 6-speed gearbox or a 4-speed Voith with a higher final drive ratio so that it wouldn’t be so loud at 60km/h. It’s always intriguing to me how the Germans are so particular on quality but then close one eye to engine noise as evident by how loud the O405s were. I’ve been to Germany and their older MANs are just as loud, especially the SD202s with their 3-speed gearboxes.
Finding a good KUB is like searching for a needle in a haystack. Most of them roar, jerk and seem difficult to control by BCs. There are a few good Euro IVs on 27 though. Their gearboxes are fantastic and radiators totally silent. Unlike the Euro Vs though, there’s that jerk when moving off in 1st gear. Most Euro Vs seem to be terribly maintained as many fail to shift up properly and have insanely loud radiators. I wonder how Scania isn’t embarrassed to sell such a sub-par quality chassis with the Gemilang bodywork.
Yeah but our Scania N113CRB and L113CRL are not bad. Very quiet engines compared to B10M and O405
Just now took TIB657M on 856, very silent when speeding..
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I agree that the old Scanias are fantastic but the KUBs are just plain horrid. The best ones are acceptable I guess but I just can't get why SBST would buy so many of such buses assuming they know how bad they really are. I know it has good carrying facility and is cheap but come on, Gemilang bodywork? I think the bodywork's to blame for many of the problems since I've taken the Discovery Bay Gemilang-bodied MANs in Hong Kong and they are just as bad, but not as bad as the Scanias.
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I agree,KUBs are bad but nobody should be like: "KUBs ARE HORRIBLE!!!SBST AND SMRT SHOULD BUY MORE CITARO'S!!! (Unlike somebody)
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Originally posted by SMB 28 G:
I agree,KUBs are bad but nobody should be like: "KUBs ARE HORRIBLE!!!SBST AND SMRT SHOULD BUY MORE CITARO'S!!! (Unlike somebody)
BUT IS FACTS!!!! -
Originally posted by nfshp253:
I agree that the old Scanias are fantastic but the KUBs are just plain horrid. The best ones are acceptable I guess but I just can’t get why SBST would buy so many of such buses assuming they know how bad they really are. I know it has good carrying facility and is cheap but come on, Gemilang bodywork? I think the bodywork’s to blame for many of the problems since I’ve taken the Discovery Bay Gemilang-bodied MANs in Hong Kong and they are just as bad, but not as bad as the Scanias.
Crappylang bodywork so dull n accident front disappear!!! -
Then why everyone worldwide is buying Scania K series buses??? KMB also buy K310UD...
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Originally posted by sbst275:
Then why everyone worldwide is buying Scania K series buses???
KMB also buy K310UD…
because Scania is widely perceived as a 'budget' option. Volvo, Merc and MAN are not so 'budget' but they will offer you more bang for your buck. The Scanias currently in operation here in sg don't seem to be in good shape, both due to maintenance and chassis quality. you get what u pay for
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I suggest you go find the prices out if you can before you say that.
If we follow your line of reasoning, we would be getting Chinese-made buses by the thousands, years ago already.
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Originally posted by SBS2601D:
I suggest you go find the prices out if you can before you say that.
If we follow your line of reasoning, we would be getting Chinese-made buses by the thousands, years ago already.
like i said, the performances and condition of Scania L113CRLs to say, Merc O405s, big difference. Assuming their prices are similar, the Merc obviously gives more bang for your buck. Why buy a Scania when you can get a Merc with better comfort, better performance and lesser downtime?
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Forget always forget after sales issue... Mercedes got better comfort? Answer me the OC issue... Furthermore MB can't in reality offer any DD buses...
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Why do we need buses that can perform for chiong when we've to settle w/ peak hour traffic condition and load... it's known that VTL officials are aware of the issue that LF buses aren't meant for SG's peak hr load...
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Off peak dun need to chiong also.. slow n steady you can still get a good bus runtime...
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Originally posted by SMB228X:
BUT IS FACTS!!!!Totally wrong for you to say that.
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Originally posted by sbst275:
Forget always forget after sales issue…
Mercedes got better comfort? Answer me the OC issue…
Furthermore MB can’t in reality offer any DD buses…
SMRT has good comfort in terms of the seats.
Legging is a problem which is MINOR to me...
Aircon is stronger, which I liked it.
And though Mercedes-Benz cannot offer DD, dun forget about bendies =D
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Originally posted by SMB228X:
Crappylang bodywork so dull n accident front disappear!!!No one say you cannot like Citaro but pls don't be racist
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Originally posted by TIB868X:
like i said, the performances and condition of Scania L113CRLs to say, Merc O405s, big difference. Assuming their prices are similar, the Merc obviously gives more bang for your buck. Why buy a Scania when you can get a Merc with better comfort, better performance and lesser downtime?
Ok.
So you claim:
Merc = More ex, more quality. Scania = Budget, low quality.
If "bang for buck" = Bang / Buck
Then Merc = Big Bang / Big Buck, Scania = Low Bang / Low buck.
What is the point that you are trying to make here??
Point 2:
The Citaro purchase price per unit was less than the K230UB.
How "budget" was the K230UB?
C'mon.
Be more convincing than a bare-faced liar leh.
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Originally posted by SBS8501U:
SMRT has good comfort in terms of the seats.
Legging is a problem which is MINOR to me...
Aircon is stronger, which I liked it.
And though Mercedes-Benz cannot offer DD, dun forget about bendies =D
bendies??? look at the WTCP or Pending Rd bus stop mess created by bendies... anyway AFAIK LTA officials are pretty bo chap abt the bendy buses... only SD or DD alrdy... Anyway comfort also has to do with the maintenance of the buses... Not saying KUB's maintenance is 100% standard, but the OC how? -
Originally posted by SBS2601D:
Ok.
So you claim:
Merc = More ex, more quality. Scania = Budget, low quality.
If "bang for buck" = Bang / Buck
Then Merc = Big Bang / Big Buck, Scania = Low Bang / Low buck.
What is the point that you are trying to make here??
Point 2:
The Citaro purchase price per unit was less than the K230UB.
How "budget" was the K230UB?
C'mon.
Be more convincing than a bare-faced liar leh.
the point is that operators around the world are buying scanias to reduce costs at the cost of performance, SBST bought a relatively budget chassis with a relatively budget bodywork.
and of course, SBST was allegedly offered the Citaros at firesale prices, the same price as the Euro IV KUBs. if Merc didn't slash their selling price, SBST would probably never have gotten the Citaros.
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Originally posted by sbst275:
Forget always forget after sales issue…
Mercedes got better comfort? Answer me the OC issue…
Furthermore MB can’t in reality offer any DD buses…
you're right but the OC500LEs would mathematically use lesser fuel during its lifetime than a K230UB. so technically its saving costs in the long run instead of saving up front but having to grapple with higher fuel consumption costs.
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Originally posted by TIB868X:
you're right but the OC500LEs would mathematically use lesser fuel during its lifetime than a K230UB. so technically its saving costs in the long run instead of saving up front but having to grapple with higher fuel consumption costs.
if you dun maintain the bus... sooner or later the cui issues will start to incur other cost... Need not point to the B7R on the CW2... cui alrdy... not to mention days back seeing the future of the MAN A22's exit door... going to fall upside down because of the maintenance and the way the sliding door was manufactured...