Daimler delivers largest Asian Citaro order to date (Part 3)
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Originally posted by SMB128B:
Woah.. Still got how many sia
Why didnt LTA buy more A22 instead? It is so superior in every aspect, the Citaro stands worse in any way. And it isnt much cheaper than the A22 (if it even is to begin with), since SMRT also has bulk discount what.
To LTA, it's not about how great the bus is, it's cost. As good as the A22 is, it's also damn expensive too. So what if the Citaro isn't much cheaper, LTA wants to buy SBS-spec buses, which is Citaro. And they spent on 122 A95s.
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If they buy in a large scale,Cost shouldn't be a big problem as the manufacturer will simply give discounts for spare part also...The contract with EvoBus also expired already so no more Citaro Euro 5 orders.Dont forget the three doors A22 in future and i hope LTA consider 12.2m chassis instead..Third door a single sliding type is just enough.
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Also Citaro is known for their problematic and sensitive engine especially those heavily restricted 1st/2nd gear SBS Plate ones..
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Originally posted by smb91y:
To LTA, it's not about how great the bus is, it's cost. As good as the A22 is, it's also damn expensive too. So what if the Citaro isn't much cheaper, LTA wants to buy SBS-spec buses, which is Citaro. And they spent on 122 A95s.
You're not making any sense here. Tell me why would the LTA SPECIFICALLY want to buy SBST buses? What is so outstanding bout SBST design (none btw) that makes LTA so craving for it?
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Originally posted by carbikebus:
If they buy in a large scale,Cost shouldn't be a big problem as the manufacturer will simply give discounts for spare part also...The contract with EvoBus also expired already so no more Citaro Euro 5 orders.Dont forget the three doors A22 in future and i hope LTA consider 12.2m chassis instead..Third door a single sliding type is just enough.
Yes. Thats why I said the A22 would not have cost any much different from Citaro.. In fact I'm convinced if LTA bulked A22 instead of the citaro they would be much cheaper than Citaro, more than the citaro is cheaper than the A22 now.. Thats coz 1. Gemilang OBVIOUSLY charges lower than Evobus, and 2. Buses are assembled out of Asia and shipping costs will obv be higher. Its not just a game of which bus gets bulk purchase yknow. Its proven that the A22 will be cheaper than the Citaro.
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Originally posted by sgbuses:
So how can you be 100% sure passengers have already stepped off the platform completely before it retracts so that an accident does not happen?
To move both simultaneously is obviously asking for trouble.
Have you not heard of sth called a pressure plate?
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Originally posted by SMB128B:
You're not making any sense here. Tell me why would the LTA SPECIFICALLY want to buy SBST buses? What is so outstanding bout SBST design (none btw) that makes LTA so craving for it?
Maybe save cost?They are known to buy the most basic thing mah
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Originally posted by SMB128B:
Have you not heard of sth called a pressure plate?
Fail-safe design?
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Originally posted by carbikebus:
Maybe save cost?They are known to buy the most basic thing mah
Ya ofc, coz SBS-spec no PIS and uses the shitty doors mah, if they want save cost might as well buy PRC.. Can move can alr wat! Since somebody Here so love to say that the only thing we should discuss here are "what commuters would notice"..
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Originally posted by carbikebus:
Becareful what you wish for..The lobbyist is watching.
They will have a field day.
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Originally posted by sgbuses:
Fail-safe design?
Basically the platform can't retract until no one is stepping on it.. What other design do u need?
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Originally posted by SMB128B:
Ya ofc, coz SBS-spec no PIS and uses the shitty doors mah, if they want save cost might as well buy PRC.. Can move can alr wat! Since somebody Here so love to say that the only thing we should discuss here are "what commuters would notice"..
Are you willing to pay minimum $4.10 bus fare?
The government has to heavily subsidize bus fares this year because they knew they got the fare calculation mechanism wrong. I don't think they will continue to do so when the new fare formula is ready.
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Originally posted by SMB128B:
Basically the platform can't retract until no one is stepping on it.. What other design do u need?
So how about a passenger whose foot hasn't touched the platform (but cleared the door area, or at first step), or touches the edge?
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Originally posted by sgbuses:
Are you willing to pay minimum $4.10 bus fare?
The government has to heavily subsidize bus fares this year because they knew they got the fare calculation mechanism wrong. I don't think they will continue to do so when the new fare formula is ready.
Honestly I'm sick and tired of hearing this bus fare thing.
How bloody much does it cost to even install a PIS? Something so ESSENTIAL to the commuters? Dont use the smartphone gimmick to shoot it down btw, there are MANY instances where apps could fail, all likely to happen.
Did you see NWST bus increase its fares after they installed PIS in 2010? No they did not. Shenzhen recently decided to mass install PIS into buses, where's the hike? I feel that the fact that uplifting service standards will necessarily cause prices to SOAR is an exaggeration. Increase yes, but not a bloody 3 dollar jump my dear friend!! This is a case of POOR FINANCIAL MANAGEMENT, not increased costs.
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Originally posted by SMB128B:
Honestly I'm sick and tired of hearing this bus fare thing.
How bloody much does it cost to even install a PIS? Something so ESSENTIAL to the commuters? Dont use the smartphone gimmick to shoot it down btw, there are MANY instances where apps could fail, all likely to happen.
Did you see NWST bus increase its fares after they installed PIS in 2010? No they did not. Shenzhen recently decided to mass install PIS into buses, where's the hike? I feel that the fact that uplifting service standards will necessarily cause prices to SOAR is an exaggeration. Increase yes, but not a bloody 3 dollar jump my dear friend!! This is a case of POOR FINANCIAL MANAGEMENT, not increased costs.
Do you know that even without those PIS, the government will be subsidizing at least 55 cents per trip (including transfers) this year?
Will you happy with LED-based PIS? Based on how you are bashing SBS Transit's interior design, I doubt you will settle for those either.
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Originally posted by sgbuses:
So how about a passenger whose foot hasn't touched the platform (but cleared the door area, or at first step), or touches the edge?
Clearly you have no idea how the third exit even looks like.
Very evidently the whatever scenario that you pointed out about a person stuck in the middle is IMPOSSIBLE to happen since the steps are right before the door. In fact since the platform is before the door ARGUABLY we dont even need the pressure plate. But since u insist then we can have it with whatever existing safety measures the doors ALREADY have.
Also pls dont insult my intelligence, and yours either, by coming with such hypothetical scenarios that I can tell you is almost impossible to happen. Stepping on the edge?? Are you even SERIOUS? If you're on the edge it means you most prob are going to land on solid ground soon anyway! stop nitpicking over issues that won't even mostly happen to denounce the overall benefits this design would bring about.
Whatever you have fault with, the picture is right there. And I think it explains everything. I dont foresee a hazard of unprecedented accidents when the bus leaves here, I dont think there should be any too.
I rest my case.
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I simply find it surprising as to what the bus fare essentially covers...while the fare is calculated based on and therefore increased by distance, there should be some basis of setting the base minimum paid by an adult at 78 cents for a typical 3.2km trip. However, aside from the distance travel issue and perhaps the proportionality between the fare revenue and operation costs, I fail to see how it can be said that the customers ought to have made more contributions to the company for them to provide better services...this is just simply putting the cart before the horse. Nevertheless, whether the lack of PIS would in fact hinder the customers from traveling smoothly without any confusions is another issue on feasibility.
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Originally posted by sgbuses:
Do you know that even without those PIS, the government will be subsidizing at least 55 cents per trip (including transfers) this year?
Will you happy with LED-based PIS? Based on how you are bashing SBS Transit's interior design, I doubt you will settle for those either.
Haha there's a reason why I keep praising SMRT's interior, even if they are using LED based.
Better than nothing that is SBST.
Also that's quite an absurd foundation to base your accusation of me on. How would bashing SBST's interior make me seem discontent with LED PIS, when SBST doesnt even have them in the first place?
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Originally posted by sgbuses:
They will have a field day.
But their spies didn't
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Originally posted by Gus.chong:
I simply find it surprising as to what the bus fare essentially covers...while the fare is calculated based on and therefore increased by distance, there should be some basis of setting the base minimum paid by an adult at 78 cents for a typical 3.2km trip. However, aside from the distance travel issue and perhaps the proportionality between the fare revenue and operation costs, I fail to see how it can be said that the customers ought to have made more contributions to the company for them to provide better services...this is just simply putting the cart before the horse. Nevertheless, whether the lack of PIS would in fact hinder the customers from traveling smoothly without any confusions is another issue on feasibility.
Assuming the latest generation PIS is installed on each WAB at $5,000 (a conservative estimate), the cost per trip will increase by at least 5 cents to cover the capital costs.
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Originally posted by SMB128B:
Clearly you have no idea how the third exit even looks like.
Very evidently the whatever scenario that you pointed out about a person stuck in the middle is IMPOSSIBLE to happen since the steps are right before the door. In fact since the platform is before the door ARGUABLY we dont even need the pressure plate. But since u insist then we can have it with whatever existing safety measures the doors ALREADY have.
Also pls dont insult my intelligence, and yours either, by coming with such hypothetical scenarios that I can tell you is almost impossible to happen. Stepping on the edge?? Are you even SERIOUS? If you're on the edge it means you most prob are going to land on solid ground soon anyway! stop nitpicking over issues that won't even mostly happen to denounce the overall benefits this design would bring about.
Whatever you have fault with, the picture is right there. And I think it explains everything. I dont foresee a hazard of unprecedented accidents when the bus leaves here, I dont think there should be any too.
I rest my case.
I have seen this photo before. I have also seen my fair share of rear exit door accidents by various passengers.
There is a very good reason why some buses are designed to be immobilized when the photosensor at the rear door fails.
If this design goes into mass production, LTA will have to introduce a new campaign telling passengers not to look at their handphone while alighting (MTR style), which will be as successful as any campaigns so far (especially that "Someone else is driving, I can daydream" poster). Or eventually disable the third door making it as useful as the Borismasters without conductors right now...
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Originally posted by Gus.chong:
I simply find it surprising as to what the bus fare essentially covers...while the fare is calculated based on and therefore increased by distance, there should be some basis of setting the base minimum paid by an adult at 78 cents for a typical 3.2km trip. However, aside from the distance travel issue and perhaps the proportionality between the fare revenue and operation costs, I fail to see how it can be said that the customers ought to have made more contributions to the company for them to provide better services...this is just simply putting the cart before the horse. Nevertheless, whether the lack of PIS would in fact hinder the customers from traveling smoothly without any confusions is another issue on feasibility.
Voice announcements of bus stops can be turned on immediately, as long as the Trapeze DDU is installed. But they currently remain disabled.
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Is this something like how automatic ramps were not installed on WAB buses?
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Originally posted by Gus.chong:
I simply find it surprising as to what the bus fare essentially covers...while the fare is calculated based on and therefore increased by distance, there should be some basis of setting the base minimum paid by an adult at 78 cents for a typical 3.2km trip. However, aside from the distance travel issue and perhaps the proportionality between the fare revenue and operation costs, I fail to see how it can be said that the customers ought to have made more contributions to the company for them to provide better services...this is just simply putting the cart before the horse. Nevertheless, whether the lack of PIS would in fact hinder the customers from traveling smoothly without any confusions is another issue on feasibility.
Do remember cash fare for adults starts at 1.40 per trip for basic svc including feeders.
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Regarding the third door theory, why not just have a wider first and second door? Serves the same purpose, right?