Double Deckers for SMRT
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No what I mean is only 1 choice that is either dd or bendy
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SMB getting 4-door bendy?
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Originally posted by iveco:
SMB getting 4-door bendy?
Most likely not, they stick to standard 2 doors for the NL323F buses
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3 doors not enough ah uncle
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My suggestions
- 61- DDs(CBD service)
- 67- Bendies(no DDs due to Dunearn Rd)
- 106- DDs(CBD service)
- 169- Bendies(effecient)
- 171- Bendies(no DDs due to Dunearn Rd)
- 172- Bendies(restrictions at Old CCK Rd and Jln Bahar)
- 176- Bendies(no DDs due to Henderson Rd)
- 180- Bendies(not a long distance route)
- 184- Bendies(no DDs due to Upp Bt Timah Rd)
- 187- DDs(Long distance route)
- 188- DDs(Long distance route)
- 189- bendies(not a long distance route)
- 190- DDs(CBD service)
- 300, 302- Bendies(Feeders)
- 700- Bendies(no DDs due to Dunearn Rd but not too many as it plies CBD)
- 800, 804, 806, 811, 812- Bendies(Feeders)
- 851- DDs(Long distance+CBD)
- 854- DDs(Long distance route)
- 856- Bendies(Short distance route)
- 857- DDs(CBD service)
- 859- Bendies(Short distance route)
- 860- Bendies(Feeder, and if demand increases, which will likely happen)
- 900, 901, 902, 903, 911, 912, 913(Feeders)
- 960- Bendies(No DDs due to Dunearn Rd)
- 962- Bendies(Short distance route)
- 963- Bendies(no DDs due to Upp Bt Timah Rd)
- 964- Bendies(short distance route)
- 969- Bendies(for effeciency along SLE and TPE)
- 971- DDs(CBD service)
- 980- DDs(Long distance route)
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At this rate, all users who want bendies out of SG will...
WHINE, NIT-PICK AND COMPLAIN HERE AND THERE...
FOR ANOTHER 17-20 YEARS, OR FOREVER...
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Haha so funny ah you.
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Not a long distance doesn't mean that DD won't be deployed as you suggested.
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Originally posted by carbikebus:
3 doors not enough ah uncle
Others suggested 4 axle, I almost fainted
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Originally posted by SBS9252G:
Not a long distance doesn't mean that DD won't be deployed as you suggested.
lol im just suggesting
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Originally posted by carbikebus:
I'm confident that Kjdep will move by 2014..Besides the Bendy is on trial till SMRT decided whether to buy more or not.Remember Yutong/Zhongtong and Lontong?
The bendy is only a trial which is not even in the recent tender, since it was built months back.And it is not yet registered. It may end up like SBST OC500LE or Kinglong demos.
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Just something to share when I drove past Woodlands depot (along Woodlands Industrial Park E4) last night, time range about 12 midnight to 1am, after I drove around the area to drop my friend back to his home nearby.
Saw a long stretch of queue of buses (single deckers and bendy bus) stretching from all the way from SMRTB side entrance along Woodlands Industrial Park E4 all the way to almost the end of Woodlands Industrial Park E5, waiting to return to depot and park the buses inside. A few MANs (with hazard lights on) parked the opposite lane along Woodlands Industrial Park E4, opposite Woodlands depot.
Driving further down towards Admiralty Road West, saw a few more single deckers (with hazard lights on) after Woodlands depot stopping by the kerb and the BCs are outside either resting or smoking. There was a SMRT personnel outside the entrance to direct the buses into the depot.
Is the situation really that bad for SMRTB depots that there is always parking crunch inside the depots and buses end up forming long queues and start/stop bumper to bumper outside the depot until every BCs spend hours wait for their turn to enter the depot to park the buses? Are bendy buses really took up too much space in depots that cause this parking crunch problem everyday? Or is it the poor fleet management by SMRTB whoch do not specifically allocate a designated slot for every bus to prevent such delays and long queues of buses outside the depot?
Sometimes I really pitied the BCs who have to spend their times for such delays to just park their buses back to their respective depots whereby if there are enough parking slots in the depot and shorter bus queues, they would have went home earlier and have more time to rest.
Problem is the poor management and heck care attitude of SMRTB all the while. It might be caused by bendy buses taking up too much spaces, which resulted in parking crunch and allocation problems. and these buses attributing long bus queues formed up along roads, which cause such delays even in non operational hours. And other problems highlighted by other forum mates in this thread and other threads.
Main point is,
Is more resting time for BCs after work more important, especially after driving for almost half a day everyday but still have to deprive more hours just because of waiting to park their bus back to depot?
And as highlighted by other forum mates, is the efficiency of bus services and operations more important, as compared to long queues formed by buses and detoriated by bendy buses along bus lanes, bus interchanges and even bus depots, be it operational hours or non operational hours? Is the fleet management efficiency more important, as compared to space crunch caused by bendy buses and high accident and burnt down rates of bendy buses?
Go figure these questions above. Are these points above more important than just for the sake of having bendy buses for more varieties? Although I may attribute most of SMRTB woes back to their poor management issues, but from the recent debates on this topic as well from other forum mates, I would like to question: are bendy buses also the cause of the downfall of SMRTB in terms of better management and operations? Still viable in the long run?
I have talked to a few SMRTB BCs before. And many of them do not like driving bendy buses, citing reasons like hard and take longer time to change lanes and overtake, have to take extra careful when turning and reversing because of the lenght, especially reversing, delays caused by these buses as they block their way to move out of or into the berth and result in excessive honkings, etc.
Just some thoughts to share here.
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Vicamour,you haven't see Amdep and Kranji more chaotic.Amdep in the first place not suitable for bendies.Last time TIBS start with either 9.5m Hino and 12m Hino and Nissan fleets.its much smaller than Ayer Rajah depot.After Woodlands bus park ready Yishun should go under Woodlands purview.Let Amdep partial control the eastern/CBD svc beside 853/854/857.Bpj should go full Wldep with 75/970 partial with Amdep.
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To 'vicamour', I think I might add onto your post about what the SMRT drivers. From what I observed lately, quite a number of those driving Bendies they're actually quite resigned to the fact that they can't tell / see clearly who is alighting or not from the front of the bus. There's the mirrors, but from the front it seems like they still can't see much, esp on crowded Bendies (which is quite common).
Which then brings them to using the closing of the doors to gauge if there's people alighting. If the doors bounce back open, that means someone is alighting. Otherwise, assume that everyone's done & drive off. Not sure if anyone else noticed this? It's a safety hazard waiting for an accident to happen though..
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Originally posted by SBS 9631X:
To 'vicamour', I think I might add onto your post about what the SMRT drivers. From what I observed lately, quite a number of those driving Bendies they're actually quite resigned to the fact that they can't tell / see clearly who is alighting or not from the front of the bus. There's the mirrors, but from the front it seems like they still can't see much, esp on crowded Bendies (which is quite common).
Which then brings them to using the closing of the doors to gauge if there's people alighting. If the doors bounce back open, that means someone is alighting. Otherwise, assume that everyone's done & drive off. Not sure if anyone else noticed this? It's a safety hazard waiting for an accident to happen though..
there are cameras at the last exit door... common sense tells you they cannot see what happens 15 metres back with a mirror
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Originally posted by vicamour:
Just something to share when I drove past Woodlands depot (along Woodlands Industrial Park E4) last night, time range about 12 midnight to 1am, after I drove around the area to drop my friend back to his home nearby.
Saw a long stretch of queue of buses (single deckers and bendy bus) stretching from all the way from SMRTB side entrance along Woodlands Industrial Park E4 all the way to almost the end of Woodlands Industrial Park E5, waiting to return to depot and park the buses inside. A few MANs (with hazard lights on) parked the opposite lane along Woodlands Industrial Park E4, opposite Woodlands depot.
Driving further down towards Admiralty Road West, saw a few more single deckers (with hazard lights on) after Woodlands depot stopping by the kerb and the BCs are outside either resting or smoking. There was a SMRT personnel outside the entrance to direct the buses into the depot.
Is the situation really that bad for SMRTB depots that there is always parking crunch inside the depots and buses end up forming long queues and start/stop bumper to bumper outside the depot until every BCs spend hours wait for their turn to enter the depot to park the buses? Are bendy buses really took up too much space in depots that cause this parking crunch problem everyday? Or is it the poor fleet management by SMRTB whoch do not specifically allocate a designated slot for every bus to prevent such delays and long queues of buses outside the depot?
Sometimes I really pitied the BCs who have to spend their times for such delays to just park their buses back to their respective depots whereby if there are enough parking slots in the depot and shorter bus queues, they would have went home earlier and have more time to rest.
Problem is the poor management and heck care attitude of SMRTB all the while. It might be caused by bendy buses taking up too much spaces, which resulted in parking crunch and allocation problems. and these buses attributing long bus queues formed up along roads, which cause such delays even in non operational hours. And other problems highlighted by other forum mates in this thread and other threads.
Main point is,
Is more resting time for BCs after work more important, especially after driving for almost half a day everyday but still have to deprive more hours just because of waiting to park their bus back to depot?
And as highlighted by other forum mates, is the efficiency of bus services and operations more important, as compared to long queues formed by buses and detoriated by bendy buses along bus lanes, bus interchanges and even bus depots, be it operational hours or non operational hours? Is the fleet management efficiency more important, as compared to space crunch caused by bendy buses and high accident and burnt down rates of bendy buses?
Go figure these questions above. Are these points above more important than just for the sake of having bendy buses for more varieties? Although I may attribute most of SMRTB woes back to their poor management issues, but from the recent debates on this topic as well from other forum mates, I would like to question: are bendy buses also the cause of the downfall of SMRTB in terms of better management and operations? Still viable in the long run?
I have talked to a few SMRTB BCs before. And many of them do not like driving bendy buses, citing reasons like hard and take longer time to change lanes and overtake, have to take extra careful when turning and reversing because of the lenght, especially reversing, delays caused by these buses as they block their way to move out of or into the berth and result in excessive honkings, etc.
Just some thoughts to share here.
The parking crunch at the depot is very bad. From what an SL told me, SMRT adjusted the timetables for the PM slot to start later because of this.
Bendy buses can carry more people than DDs. They are longer BUT the faster boarding and alighting offsets this, so I don't see why SMRT should drop bendies totally.
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Originally posted by dan474:
there are cameras at the last exit door... common sense tells you they cannot see what happens 15 metres back with a mirror
i'm trying to imply that with mirrors/cameras or without, they're using the closing/bouncing open of doors as a gauge to see if anyone's alighting. That's provided the sensors work. LOL.
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Originally posted by SBS 9631X:
i'm trying to imply that with mirrors/cameras or without, they're using the closing/bouncing open of doors as a gauge to see if anyone's alighting. That's provided the sensors work. LOL.
not really...
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Originally posted by dan474:
Bendy buses can carry more people than DDs. They are longer BUT the faster boarding and alighting offsets this, so I don't see why SMRT should drop bendies totally.
Only about 10 people more but takes up almost twice the space, and just about 1 min faster for alighting (but boarding is actually same as double deckers but it's actually worse off for the time and the space it delays the buses behind) I don't see it worthwhile after all.
Originally posted by SBS 9631X:To 'vicamour', I think I might add onto your post about what the SMRT drivers. From what I observed lately, quite a number of those driving Bendies they're actually quite resigned to the fact that they can't tell / see clearly who is alighting or not from the front of the bus. There's the mirrors, but from the front it seems like they still can't see much, esp on crowded Bendies (which is quite common).
Which then brings them to using the closing of the doors to gauge if there's people alighting. If the doors bounce back open, that means someone is alighting. Otherwise, assume that everyone's done & drive off. Not sure if anyone else noticed this? It's a safety hazard waiting for an accident to happen though..
Not just that.
The 3rd door has cameras but the BC alone can't possibly monitor all the 3 doors at the same time, especially busy timings. Sometimes they might even forgot to open or close the 3rd door and move off with the door open.Originally posted by carbikebus:Vicamour,you haven't see Amdep and Kranji more chaotic.Amdep in the first place not suitable for bendies.Last time TIBS start with either 9.5m Hino and 12m Hino and Nissan fleets.its much smaller than Ayer Rajah depot.After Woodlands bus park ready Yishun should go under Woodlands purview.Let Amdep partial control the eastern/CBD svc beside 853/854/857.Bpj should go full Wldep with 75/970 partial with Amdep.
Carbikebus, my take for the reorganisation of SMRTB if the new CEO really cares about the bus operations this time.- You have mentioned that Ang Mo Kio and Kranji Depot to be shifted soon. So Ang Mo Kio depot should shift somewhere near to the current site but bigger for more buses (Approx 300 buses.) Kranji to moved to Mandai with about 400 buses. The new upcoming Woodlands depot for about 300 buses. That should cater about 1000 buses in future. All noew depots should be double decker friendly.
- Standardise all the fleet to normal lenght (12m) including single deckers and double deckers only to make economies of scales in purchasing and maintainance more cost efficient and much more easier (e.g parts, parking, maintanance). I think SMRTB should stop using bendy buses based on the parking crunch I observed yesterday. Even if they can last for this generation, they won't enter into the next generation. Like what some forums mates have said, they aren't really suitable in crowded country like Singapore in the long run. SMRTB might as well correct the mistakes and problems from now, if they really serious about improving.
- Geylang Depot fate is mostly decided one day. The govt will not waste such a prime land for a bus depot. Most likely it will become a high end residential/commercial site since it is near the MRT. Matter is how soon or late it is. SMRTB can use the current Woodlands depot site instead to service SMRT cabs and Bus Plus buses instead and other non public bus operations, such as repairing other vehicles out of their boundary, if they stubbornly think it is still al right. Public bus operations are only based in other depots like the new one in Woodlands and replacements for Ang Mo Kio and Kranji.
- Lastly, SMRTB should stop operating all shuttle bus services and RWS services and concentrate the resources (BCs and buses) to more improvements, like introducing at least 2 basic trunk services in Sembawang.
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Originally posted by vicamour:
Only about 10 people more but takes up almost twice the space, and just about 1 min faster for alighting (but boarding is actually same as double deckers but it's actually worse off for the time and the space it delays the buses behind) I don't see it worthwhile after all.
Not just that.
The 3rd door has cameras but the BC alone can't possibly monitor all the 3 doors at the same time, especially busy timings. Sometimes they might even forgot to open or close the 3rd door and move off with the door open.
Carbikebus, my take for the reorganisation of SMRTB if the new CEO really cares about the bus operations this time.- You have mentioned that Ang Mo Kio and Kranji Depot to be shifted soon. So Ang Mo Kio depot should shift somewhere near to the current site but bigger for more buses (Approx 300 buses.) Kranji to moved to Mandai with about 400 buses. The new upcoming Woodlands depot for about 300 buses. That should cater about 1000 buses in future.
- Standardise all the fleet to normal lenght (12m) including single deckers and double deckers only to make economies of scales in purchasing and maintainance more cost efficient and much more easier (e.g parts, parking, maintanance). I think SMRTB should stop using bendy buses based on the parking crunch I observed yesterday. Even if they can last for this generation, they won't enter into the next generation. Like what some forums mates have said, they aren't really suitable in crowded country like Singapore in the long run. SMRTB might as well correct the mistakes and problems from now, if they really serious about improving.
- Geylang Depot fate is mostly decided one day. The govt will not waste such a prime land for a bus depot. Most likely it will become a high end residential/commercial site since it is near the MRT. Matter is how soon or late it is. SMRTB can use the current Woodlands depot site instead to service SMRT cabs and Bus Plus buses instead and other non public bus operations, such as repairing other vehicles out of their boundary, if they stubbornly think it is still al right. Public bus operations are only based in other depots like the new one in Woodlands and replacements for Ang Mo Kio and Kranji.
- Lastly, SMRTB should stop operating all shuttle bus services and RWS services and concentrate the resources (BCs and buses) to more improvements, like introducing at least 2 basic trunk services in Sembawang.
standardising the fleet to 12m buses is not an option. its a matter of finding space to park and deploying them to the correct service. what will happen to high-demand routes that cannot have DDs? put more 12m buses? they can't even find enough drivers.
right now they are sticking to merc, MAN and gemilang for a reason. merc (OC/Citaro) and MAN engine spare parts are interchangeable and its easy and fast to get spare parts for bodywork.
stopping the usage of bendy buses will paralyse SMRT. quite a number of their routes need high capacity buses and DDs wont make the cut because of height restrictions along the route. the same as my above point, buy more 12m rigids but nobody to drive them.
stopping their shuttle bus services is as good as throwing out busplus. what for they close down their chartering sector when they are quite well known for their charter services, especially for big events? they just need to improve on their services like introducing school bus service.
no comment for depot issue though, not so familiar with that
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Simpang and Tengah? May be the next issue coming for SMRT in the future.
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The Simple Rule of Thumb
When single rigids can't work, you can get more double deckers.
But when double deckers can't work, you can only get bendies.
This is a standard rule which no one can ever deny.
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Please explain how SBST deals with feeders that do not use DDs.
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Originally posted by SBS2601D:
Please explain how SBST deals with feeders that do not use DDs.
272, 275, 292, 372?