Double Deckers for SMRT
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Originally posted by SBS 6078 M:
Really, the DDs are usually empty. Probably a bus the pax already. But when 1 time I played with iris, they said the bus infront is a non-WAB bus. Might be the B10Ms though, but theres also a possibility it was a VO
How long do u even see 87? During evening peak people board like crazy at Eunos Link, and DDs usually get full house when it reaches HG ave 3/Bedok Reservoir Rd. You sure DDs on 87 not full? Please check again. Even during off peak, you can see how long the queue is back at Bedok int.
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Originally posted by SBS 6078 M:
Really, the DDs are usually empty. Probably a bus the pax already. But when 1 time I played with iris, they said the bus infront is a non-WAB bus. Might be the B10Ms though, but theres also a possibility it was a VO
No yaa... Not possible... The DDs on 151 could be empty (that is just 3 buses though in its whole fleet) but DDs on 25, 51, 55, 62, 87 are always packed to the brim in this area. The DDs on 81 could be empty depending on time.
I think there might be 1 bus right in front because of which the one you saw might be empty, but normally the loading pattern at HG Ave 3 / Tampines road junction is:
25 - 100+
51 - 50/60 pax
55 - 100+
62 - 80/90 pax
87 - 100+
(assuming there is no bus right ahead of the same #)
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Originally posted by SMB128B:
How long do u even see 87? During evening peak people board like crazy at Eunos Link, and DDs usually get full house when it reaches HG ave 3/Bedok Reservoir Rd. You sure DDs on 87 not full? Please check again. Even during off peak, you can see how long the queue is back at Bedok int.
Agree. -
Originally posted by BusAnalayzer:
No yaa... Not possible... The DDs on 151 could be empty (that is just 3 buses though in its whole fleet) but DDs on 25, 51, 55, 62, 87 are always packed to the brim in this area. The DDs on 81 could be empty depending on time.
I think there might be 1 bus right in front because of which the one you saw might be empty, but normally the loading pattern at HG Ave 3 / Tampines road junction is:
25 - 100+
51 - 50/60 pax
55 - 100+
62 - 80/90 pax
87 - 100+
(assuming there is no bus right ahead of the same #)
took 7313C on 151 ytd evening around 5.30, from macpherson to hougang. bus very empty, around 10 pax only, sbst also need to time their dd better... (not a regular 151 commuter so the demand may have been from KRT to somewhere before macpherson)
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151's main loading doesn't come from that sector at all. Except in the morning from HG.
DD allocation seems to be based on visibility exercise.
Fleets like 74 and 147 are not full DD although its so badly needed, because replacing those few SD will have no visible improvement to the general public.
Put a couple of DDs on 151 and they will say, oh look! 151 improved! Which is hardly the case at all.
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Originally posted by TIB868X:
took 7313C on 151 ytd evening around 5.30, from macpherson to hougang. bus very empty, around 10 pax only, sbst also need to time their dd better... (not a regular 151 commuter so the demand may have been from KRT to somewhere before macpherson)
151 doesn't need DDs. There used to b 4 perm DDs on it, now it is 3. The route parallels 154 from Clementi road all the way to Macpherson. 151 evening DD peak loading is Kent Ridge to Bukit Timah Road. When it comes to Macpherson and beyond, the loading has already dropped.
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Originally posted by SBS2601D:
151's main loading doesn't come from that sector at all. Except in the morning from HG.
DD allocation seems to be based on visibility exercise.
Fleets like 74 and 147 are not full DD although its so badly needed, because replacing those few SD will have no visible improvement to the general public.
Put a couple of DDs on 151 and they will say, oh look! 151 improved! Which is hardly the case at all.
I feel if DDs are added to 74, it will be a visible service improvement. There are so many times when you wait for a 74 and see a packed SD coming and you go like "Why is it not a DD?" Many echo this feeling.
And I dont understand that when there are so many spare Wrights, why don't they deploy.
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Originally posted by BusAnalayzer:
151 doesn't need DDs. There used to b 4 perm DDs on it, now it is 3. The route parallels 154 from Clementi road all the way to Macpherson. 151 evening DD peak loading is Kent Ridge to Bukit Timah Road. When it comes to Macpherson and beyond, the loading has already dropped.
I daren't say 151 doesnt need DD.
151's loading is not very predictable and the crowd at Toa Payoh is not small at all. And rest assure that PM peak 151 DD is full-house from NUS.
It is not uncommon to see a full-house 151 SD skip all stops along Bukit Timah Rd because of the Toa Payoh crowd and I can sympathise with that.
The only thing predictable about 151 is its unpredictable frequency.
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Originally posted by BusAnalayzer:
151 doesn't need DDs. There used to b 4 perm DDs on it, now it is 3. The route parallels 154 from Clementi road all the way to Macpherson. 151 evening DD peak loading is Kent Ridge to Bukit Timah Road. When it comes to Macpherson and beyond, the loading has already dropped.
SBST, reinstate 151A!
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Originally posted by TIB868X:
SBST, reinstate 151A!
For 151A to be deemed worthy of a reinstatement it has to at least terminate at Jln TPY Trellis Twrs, if not might as well serve full trip. Terminating at Aft Kheam Hock Rd is plain useless imo. -
I think its because its much easier to do the U turn at BTC rather than trying something liddat at Toa Payoh.
But yes.
151A was an pretty much a useless service and it made sense for SBST to withdraw it.
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151 DDs cater more to AM Peak crowd timing than PM Peak. Please take the DD trips departing from Hougang during AM Peak.
PM Peak of the 3 DDs I think only 1 will have sizable loading on its peak trip.
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I have taken before. AM Peak leaving at 7+am from HG.
Its completely empty throughout.
Its the same reason why the DD leaves NUS empty and the next SD becomes full house.
Scheduling issues. The DD I took came 5 min after a SD left HG. Of course it would be empty.
Nonetheless I cannot say 151 doesnt need DD.
Because 151 does become full house when you least expect.
And I dont want to say more, but there are a number of 151 BCs who mess up the schedule and cause all kinds of screwed-up frequency.
One common tactic is to race with the 154....to see who can go slower.
All to avoid picking up the crowd.
Nuff said.
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151 unpredictable,Last time I drive from Hg to Krt at 1530hrs no standees at all,But return leg the WA MkII pack like sardines sial.
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Originally posted by SMB128B:
Please observe the loading pattern of 900 and 901. People come people go. Where will got people go upper deck one?
The ppl on woodlands feeders are more than a DD can hold. As a result, people have to stand on the stairs when a DD is deployed. But bendies are different. They can hold standees at their rear portion and also the articulation joint area.
Also, please take a look at how WILD people unload at Admiralty Stn when 913 pulls by. People SPAM out of the bus straightaway. With only one exit door that have to cope with both upper and lower deck pax at once, do you think a DD can cope?
It is also the pax and the BC's adaptations and habit. That's why the SBST feeders and townlinks can successfully utilise DDs on its svcs. To elaborate more on the not moving to the upper deck problem, people may have this habit of not moving to the top as they know how painful it is to alight EVEN from bendies, LEAVE ALONE DDs.
If u ask me, I think DDs are better utilised on 700, or 857 as you said. Also can be well utilised on 853, as the load at Kallang can get real traumatic at peak. But for Woodlands feeders or intratowns, it's a no-no, at least for me.
Bendies are already so messy in Woodlands interchange. Look at all the jams they created during peak hours. People have to even walk on the road to the berth when alighting the buses because bendy buses block all the way for the buses behind. And you think people move in on board bendy buses, BCs also need to shout. Sometimes you even see the back trailer with no standees, waste of space on the roads, block other buses way as well.
291 and 241 loads are also very heavy but you don't always see delays and jams in the bus stops and interchanges, unlike bendies which also creates messy jams and bottel necks in Woodlands intechange, long queues as well for Yishun and Chu Chua Kang interchange.
Woodlands don't need more bendies, they need 1 or 2 more feeder bus services to balance the load from the current feeder services.
Originally posted by TIB 501 D:Look at those rain trees...
. It is the no.1 enemy to DDs.They are found in- WDL Rd, Upp Bt Timah Rd, Dunearn Rd, Telok Blangah Way, Henderson Rd, Depot Rd, PK Estate, and Upp Aljunied Rd.
Henderson Rd is the most absurd one, the branches are SOOOOO low...
Raintrees are everywhere in Singapore.Why other places not affected using DDs???
And raintrees can grow at heights taller than a DD.
Originally posted by SMB128B:Lol really fail eh u. Buay song still must geh kiang go rebutt me with boarding door. So? DD also one boarding door only wat!
Wad u dunno that bendies got standing space also meh? Do u noe y SMRT removed the seats for some of the EWL C151s? Basically, the joint area of bendies is like the stairs of DD, only DD stairs can't take standees.
Wrights got TWO Wheelchair bays? What a joke!!! Thx for making me having the laugh of the day BTW. Dunno how count? A bay is big u noe. And yes, when bendies WAB come by, u will see the same benefit on bendies.
Bendies 50 pax??? Wow how often u take bendies boy? Please lah, the length of bendies are 3/2 the length of DDs leh.
I mean please lah, even trunks DDs like 86 have an empty upper deck when leaving the interchange. U wan talk about SMRT feeders? Please GTFO. CBD I can still accept this argument, but bendies are bought for the feeders and svcs like 67, and no pathetic DDs are available for your absurd requests as they are busy on svcs like 190. TYVM.
So???One bloody bendy bus stuck there for 5 mins to load all the passnegers and block the way of all the buses behind. One DD also take up 5 mins to load all the passengers but don't block the other buses behind in the bus stop.
That is the main reason why every morning the bus stop outside Yishun interchange and inside interchange to jammed by bendy buses everyday. Everytime have to waste time waiting for those stupid bendy buses infront to clear before my bus can actually move into the bus stop or exit from Yishun interchange into Yishun Ave 2.
Sometimes I wish I can break that stupid bendies into half.
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Originally posted by SBS 1000U:
Bendies are already so messy in Woodlands interchange. Look at all the jams they created during peak hours. People have to even walk on the road to the berth when alighting the buses because bendy buses block all the way for the buses behind. And you think people move in on board bendy buses, BCs also need to shout. Sometimes you even see the back trailer with no standees, waste of space on the roads, block other buses way as well.
291 and 241 loads are also very heavy but you don't always see delays and jams in the bus stops and interchanges, unlike bendies which also creates messy jams and bottel necks in Woodlands intechange, long queues as well for Yishun and Chu Chua Kang interchange.
Woodlands don't need more bendies, they need 1 or 2 more feeder bus services to balance the load from the current feeder services.
Can you elaborate? You said WRI already flooded like shit and you still said add 1 to 2 more fbs? Even if they use rigids it'll create more tremendous jams. You have to edit your post or else people will misunderstand. If you want to add fbs, think ways of reducing few bendies to rigids and give them to AMDEP
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Originally posted by SBS 1000U:
Bendies are already so messy in Woodlands interchange. Look at all the jams they created during peak hours. People have to even walk on the road to the berth when alighting the buses because bendy buses block all the way for the buses behind. And you think people move in on board bendy buses, BCs also need to shout. Sometimes you even see the back trailer with no standees, waste of space on the roads, block other buses way as well.
291 and 241 loads are also very heavy but you don't always see delays and jams in the bus stops and interchanges, unlike bendies which also creates messy jams and bottel necks in Woodlands intechange, long queues as well for Yishun and Chu Chua Kang interchange.
Woodlands don't need more bendies, they need 1 or 2 more feeder bus services to balance the load from the current feeder services.
Yo boy.
I am talking about Woodlands feeders.
Woodlands. Where do you stay?
I can understand the bendy situation at Woodlands Int. that is a minority. So are you telling me DDs can do better? Please lah. Woodlands Int was built bigger to house in the bendies, serves a purpose you know. Packed interchanges are inevitable.
And yes, BCs shouting is common. SDs have this problem also. DD worse still. Block the stairway. People wan move up also cannot. How can you confirm bendies in Woodlands don't have pax at the trailer?
And again, it's WOODLANDS I'm talking about here, if you're stupid enough not to understand English. Please don't pull in Yishun and CCK here. We're not talking about utilisation of bendies here.
Yes, bendies go faster than DDs. That means more efficient rides. Faster to balik kampong. DDs move terribly slow do you know.
Please lah. We ppl oso lazy listen you this kind of ppl, coz you're talking for sake of logic, but the sake of YOUR OWN. A person who 100% despise bendies and create havoc in a bendy club. C'mon lah, if you're not happy, f*** off lah, at least I still justify between DDs and bendies, you? See not happy argue. I only got to say: wrong place kid.
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Originally posted by SBS 1000U:
Raintrees are everywhere in Singapore.
Why other places not affected using DDs???
And raintrees can grow at heights taller than a DD.
You need a lesson on biology my young boy.
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Originally posted by SBS 6078 M:
Can you elaborate? You said WRI already flooded like shit and you still said add 1 to 2 more fbs? Even if they use rigids it'll create more tremendous jams. You have to edit your post or else people will misunderstand. If you want to add fbs, think ways of reducing few bendies to rigids and give them to AMDEP
If you park at the berth for boarding and alighting the length of the bus always blocks the way of other buses behind. The trailer part espcially blocks the path of the other bus behind.
If it is boarding, only 1 bendy can stop there and allow boarding. Bus behind have to wait. If it is a SD, at least there is space for another bus behind to stop at the berth for passengers of another bus service to board, and can move off after all its passengers boarded. At least the bus did not block the path of another bus in the berth behind. But bendy bus is different. The whole of the lenght blocks the bus behind to delay its baording process and the rear trailer sometimes even black the bus behind another berth. Alighting is the same. Epic part is that if one bendy bus stuck at the rearmost alighting berth, it creates a whole queue of jams behind. Worst is when 2 bendy buses hog 2 alighting berths, other buses have no choice but to stop in between the 2 bendies and away from the kerb to allow people to alight, which is so dangerous and inconvenient. Not to mention that people have to walk more after alighting the bus, especially when some BCs are so fed up with these queues and jams that they decided to berth at somewhere further to avoid them.
Because of these, other buses behind have to delay, BCs breaktimes delayed, passengers waiting times delayed and all these delays waste a lot of time and decreases the efficiency of buses.
12m buses are different. They have the flexibility of moving in and out more easily once they have done their business. No need to take up so much space on the roads and berths. No need to waste so much time to change lane and just to move the whole damn lenghty thing out which takes more time and space just to move out.
Just look at the queues and jams they created in the bus interchanges everyday. Even the BCs are so tired of them which makes them honk at these buses many times.
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Originally posted by SMB128B:
Yo boy.
I am talking about Woodlands feeders.
Woodlands. Where do you stay?
I can understand the bendy situation at Woodlands Int. that is a minority. So are you telling me DDs can do better? Please lah. Woodlands Int was built bigger to house in the bendies, serves a purpose you know. Packed interchanges are inevitable.
And yes, BCs shouting is common. SDs have this problem also. DD worse still. Block the stairway. People wan move up also cannot. How can you confirm bendies in Woodlands don't have pax at the trailer?
And again, it's WOODLANDS I'm talking about here, if you're stupid enough not to understand English. Please don't pull in Yishun and CCK here. We're not talking about utilisation of bendies here.
Yes, bendies go faster than DDs. That means more efficient rides. Faster to balik kampong. DDs move terribly slow do you know.
Please lah. We ppl oso lazy listen you this kind of ppl, coz you're talking for sake of logic, but the sake of YOUR OWN. A person who 100% despise bendies and create havoc in a bendy club. C'mon lah, if you're not happy, f*** off lah, at least I still justify between DDs and bendies, you? See not happy argue. I only got to say: wrong place kid.
Minority??? GO observe more before talking rubbish here. everytime I go Woodlands interchange there is sure to be a jam somewhere, unless it is very late at night.You think Woodlands interchange will still cope in future when the govt wants to put more buses in future??? Do you think the govt will continue to let the packed interchange problem to be inevitable forever??? Sorry, that is not the govt wants, packed and jammed bus interchanges. In this case, they will never justify the money they spend on more buses and bus services for the future. And they won't expand the interchange further just to house bendies in future. The land space needs in future are for other purposes as well. If they can use more buses at standard lenghts that gives them better efficiencies using the same land area, it is more justifiable for them to standardise their operations, rather than all the long bendies that creates more jams, queues and mess and wasting more land space just to house them.
The current SMRT depots are already so crowded and messy and buses have to park outside the depot. All thanks to those road hogging bendies. I won't want SMRT to get any new bendies. I hope they can get all standard 12m SDs and DDs which gives them much less problems in delays, space constraints and scheduling in their bus operations. I hope they can be as efficient as SBST as well.
Bendies go faster than DDs??? My foot. Bendies tend to hog as well, especially single lane roads. A nightmare for other buses and motorists behind. And they are very accident prone, having the highest accident rate compared to DDs and SDs. And no need for so fast in urban operations, engines wear out faster, buses burnt faster and you see more bendies burnt. Shortage of buses just because of all these burnt bendies costs SMRT bus operations negatively. Look like you never seen a DD overtake a bendy before as well. You are always living in your well.
Lazy to listen then too bad for you, because you refuse to accept the truth. Continue to live in your own world. Cannot argue, say lazy and spew vulgarities. Epic.
Originally posted by SMB128B:You need a lesson on biology my young boy.
I've seen tall raintrees before, lazy boy. -
Originally posted by SBS 1000U:
If you park at the berth for boarding and alighting the length of the bus always blocks the way of other buses behind. The trailer part espcially blocks the path of the other bus behind.
If it is boarding, only 1 bendy can stop there and allow boarding. Bus behind have to wait. If it is a SD, at least there is space for another bus behind to stop at the berth for passengers of another bus service to board, and can move off after all its passengers boarded. At least the bus did not block the path of another bus in the berth behind. But bendy bus is different. The whole of the lenght blocks the bus behind to delay its baording process and the rear trailer sometimes even black the bus behind another berth. Alighting is the same. Epic part is that if one bendy bus stuck at the rearmost alighting berth, it creates a whole queue of jams behind. Worst is when 2 bendy buses hog 2 alighting berths, other buses have no choice but to stop in between the 2 bendies and away from the kerb to allow people to alight, which is so dangerous and inconvenient. Not to mention that people have to walk more after alighting the bus, especially when some BCs are so fed up with these queues and jams that they decided to berth at somewhere further to avoid them.
Because of these, other buses behind have to delay, BCs breaktimes delayed, passengers waiting times delayed and all these delays waste a lot of time and decreases the efficiency of buses.
12m buses are different. They have the flexibility of moving in and out more easily once they have done their business. No need to take up so much space on the roads and berths. No need to waste so much time to change lane and just to move the whole damn lenghty thing out which takes more time and space just to move out.
Just look at the queues and jams they created in the bus interchanges everyday. Even the BCs are so tired of them which makes them honk at these buses many times.
All SMRT bus are SDs. It is just that they are seperated into rigids and bendies. If they dont use bendies, how are they going to take the load? You going to ask SMRT waste more money buy those rigids which are pretty useless during p hours. And some of the bendies still have to wait for 11 more years till de-registration. You cant expect SMRT to buy DDs as they have their disadvantages too. Everything has it advantages and disadvantages. If you're whining here about bendies and showing your rage and hatred in this thread, then I advise you. Either fuck off or dont even bother to come here. Coming here and showing your hatred is just flooding this thread with your nonsense. Why even bother coming here when you're just talking about bendies, not DDs for SMRT? Use some common sense kids, if you want DDs so badly, go fork out the sum of money yourself. Look at those buses in Nepal, those buses are either NAC or CAC. And those CAC buses' aircon don't even work sometimes. So stop whining for we're already fortunate enough to have good buses in Singapore. Nepal dosen't even have bendies or DD, not even a single unit. If you want to continue to whine here, go create a thread yourself and whine it out there, nobody would care about it and you won't get banned.
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Originally posted by SBS 6078 M:
All SMRT bus are SDs. It is just that they are seperated into rigids and bendies. If they dont use bendies, how are they going to take the load? You going to ask SMRT waste more money buy those rigids which are pretty useless during p hours. And some of the bendies still have to wait for 11 more years till de-registration. You cant expect SMRT to buy DDs as they have their disadvantages too. Everything has it advantages and disadvantages. If you're whining here about bendies and showing your rage and hatred in this thread, then I advise you. Either fuck off or dont even bother to come here. Coming here and showing your hatred is just flooding this thread with your nonsense. Why even bother coming here when you're just talking about bendies, not DDs for SMRT? Use some common sense kids, if you want DDs so badly, go fork out the sum of money yourself. Look at those buses in Nepal, those buses are either NAC and CAC. And those CAC buses' aircon don't even work sometimes. So stop whining for we're already fortunate enough to have good buses in Singapore. Nepal dosen't even have bendies or DD, not even a single unit. If you want to continue to whine here, go create a thread yourself and whine it out there, nobody would care about it and you won't get banned.
I am not saying not stop using them immediately. I said before SMRT can gradually change to DDs while the exisiting bendies are being scrapped in the coming years. The transport landscape is changing from now, we can't keep on harping on the old problems forever. Yes, they may have advantages but having more disadvantages than SDs and DDs. How much longer and how much more problems is the govt going to face if these problems don't get solved now??? 11 years??? The last batch has less than 8 years left. These years are good enough that SMRT gradually change to DDs while taking into consideration of more buses on the roads in future and DTL.
You are not for discussion then keep quiet. Another epic example to spew vulgarities to justify your points.
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Originally posted by SBS 1000U:
I am not saying not stop using them immediately. I said before SMRT can gradually change to DDs while the exisiting bendies are being scrapped in the coming years. The transport landscape is changing from now, we can't keep on harping on the old problems forever. Yes, they may have advantages but having more disadvantages than SDs and DDs. How much longer and how much more problems is the govt going to face if these problems don't get solved now??? 11 years??? The last batch has less than 8 years left. These years are good enough that SMRT gradually change to DDs while taking into consideration of more buses on the roads in future and DTL.
You are not for discussion then keep quiet. Another epic example to spew vulgarities to justify your points.
There will be refurbished bendies and the last batch were registered in 2004. If refurbished it will be 19 years and 2004 + 19 = 2023. And you're also not on for discussion, so what gives you the right to ask people to keep quiet? You're just whining here by showing your hatred to bendies. I doubt they would even purchase DDs as DTLs are coming. SMRT will sort out their problem themselves and it won't help in any bit if you continue to whine here. And it's not like you say scrap this bus then scrap this bus. You must give a particular reason if it is not burnt / accident before it's lifespan ends. Plus I've already showed a photo of how much trouble is needed to go through to scrap just 1 particular DD. Though a bendy might be more easy to scrap, that dosen't mean you say "SCRAP" means scrap in 1 day.
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Originally posted by SBS 6078 M:
All SMRT bus are SDs. It is just that they are seperated into rigids and bendies. If they dont use bendies, how are they going to take the load? You going to ask SMRT waste more money buy those rigids which are pretty useless during p hours. And some of the bendies still have to wait for 11 more years till de-registration. You cant expect SMRT to buy DDs as they have their disadvantages too. Everything has it advantages and disadvantages. If you're whining here about bendies and showing your rage and hatred in this thread, then I advise you. Either fuck off or dont even bother to come here. Coming here and showing your hatred is just flooding this thread with your nonsense. Why even bother coming here when you're just talking about bendies, not DDs for SMRT? Use some common sense kids, if you want DDs so badly, go fork out the sum of money yourself. Look at those buses in Nepal, those buses are either NAC and CAC. And those CAC buses' aircon don't even work sometimes. So stop whining for we're already fortunate enough to have good buses in Singapore. Nepal dosen't even have bendies or DD, not even a single unit. If you want to continue to whine here, go create a thread yourself and whine it out there, nobody would care about it and you won't get banned.
I agree with you. Nobody will be able to board any bus at the bus stops where the sectors are full of passengers if SMRT only have rigid buses.
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Originally posted by SBS 6078 M:
There will be refurbished bendies and the last batch were registered in 2004. If refurbished it will be 19 years and 2004 + 19 = 2023.
SMRT will still be purchasing bendies in the future, so the last batch of bendies are not the Hispano Habits.