QoS for Jun - Nov 09: "Bus services improving", says PTC
-
Originally posted by service_238:
There seems to be a pattern in the heartlands that are far from the city centre. the 8pm+ trips in these towns can also be packed with people. This actually goes in line with where most people who travel by public transport work.Say the big 3 in the east. Demand actually starts to drop after 8.30 or 9pm. the farther from city centre, the later it drops. Coupled with split shift keeping and meal breaks ending the frequency will drag a little after the core pm peak period.
Conversely, it also means the pre-am peak load is likely to be heavy especially if pax are travelling a great distance to their workplace. That is why the Boon Lay feeder loads drop after 7.45am. This allows 242 and 243 buses to cross to 179/199 respectively for the student loads.
Towns near the city centre like Clementi, Bt Merah, Toa Payoh and Serangoon are pretty tricky. By theory the loads should drop after 8pm but due to residents taking advantage of their geographical residential convenience, they may go home later from the city centre than people who stay farther away. In the end, demand may only drop at the same time as the towns farther away from city centre.
I agree that frequency tends to get screwed after the QoS 10min freq especially for PM peak (AM peak not so jia lat). The problem lies here is the pm shift mealbreaks cannot be too early (cos they start like 1.5-2hours then meal break), and neither it can be too late (split shift keep liao means with mealbreak = longer headway). Either way still screwed that's why they stick to the current way.
Extending the QoS 10min freq period isnt financially viable either, depending on service. Maybe they can consider 12min for the 30-45min period after the 10min pm peak-within-peak period. Services from the city centre may sound good as compared to services serving the heartlands. The impact on the points i raised in the earlier para wont be so much, and yet still able to satisfy a group of commuters who happen to take during this period. But of course having 12min post peak-within-peak period may also lead to even longer headways after that period. Its hard to balance.
The QoS 10 mins time belt is quite hindering PM peak operations.
Actually should leave it to PTOs to decide over the 10 mins for PM peak, it could be replaced w/ 12 mins freq but w/ ADDs deployed. But it's not going to be possible in the short term.
-
Originally posted by sbst275:
The QoS 10 mins time belt is quite hindering PM peak operations.
Actually should leave it to PTOs to decide over the 10 mins for PM peak, it could be replaced w/ 12 mins freq but w/ ADDs deployed. But it's not going to be possible in the short term.
12-minute headway over a 2-hour period (11 trips inclusive) seems to be a better solution for the greater good. currently most services have to cope with close to 15-minute headway within the 2-hour peak (11 trips inclusive also) just to "spam" trips for that 1-hour period.
Current scenario:
1700 1710 1720 1730 1740 1750 1800 1815 1830 1845 1900Proposed scenario:
1700 1712 1724 1736 1748 1800 1812 1824 1836 1848 1900 -
Originally posted by sbst275:
As for Sv 969.
My 2 cents thought is to intro a Sv 969A. It would end at Yishun Ave 5 and off service back to Tampines via Upp Thomson Rd, SLE, TPE.
The statistics for people travelling from TPE into Lentor Avenue shows that for Services 858 (old route) and 969 combined, while half of all passengers onboard alight at Yishun MRT, approximately the same number of people will board the buses to head into Woodlands. In fact, passenger flow is steady all the way to first stop of Woodlands New Town, and there is no drastic drop in passengers after the proposed end-point of the SWT. So there is no basis to do the off service manuerve.
-
Originally posted by SBS7888K:
The statistics for people travelling from TPE into Lentor Avenue shows that for Services 858 (old route) and 969 combined, while half of all passengers onboard alight at Yishun MRT, approximately the same number of people will board the buses to head into Woodlands. In fact, passenger flow is steady all the way to first stop of Woodlands New Town, and there is no drastic drop in passengers after the proposed end-point of the SWT. So there is no basis to do the off service manuerve.
mmm... -
Originally posted by SBS7888K:
12-minute headway over a 2-hour period (11 trips inclusive) seems to be a better solution for the greater good. currently most services have to cope with close to 15-minute headway within the 2-hour peak (11 trips inclusive also) just to "spam" trips for that 1-hour period.
Current scenario:
1700 1710 1720 1730 1740 1750 1800 1815 1830 1845 1900Proposed scenario:
1700 1712 1724 1736 1748 1800 1812 1824 1836 1848 1900
hanor. But I still feel if it's Svs like 32, probably could do it this way taking into consideration it's off peak freq for a smoother transition.1720 1732 1744 1756 1808 1820 1833 1847 1901 1915 1930
-
Originally posted by service_238:
Conversely, it also means the pre-am peak load is likely to be heavy especially if pax are travelling a great distance to their workplace. That is why the Boon Lay feeder loads drop after 7.45am. This allows 242 and 243 buses to cross to 179/199 respectively for the student loads.
sure bo.. 241 loading is rather high between 7.45am to 8.30am..
-
Originally posted by sbst275:
The QoS 10 mins time belt is quite hindering PM peak operations.
Actually should leave it to PTOs to decide over the 10 mins for PM peak, it could be replaced w/ 12 mins freq but w/ ADDs deployed. But it's not going to be possible in the short term.
Agreed. For instance, 962 with full fleet bendies back then running at around 12 to 15 minutes provided a just nice capacity. But having bendies coming every 10 minutes would be an overkill, which is why they had to be substituted with rigids. But as a result, you get sardine-packed rigids. Which is why some bendies remain, alternating between the rigids.
-
Can they improve 966's frequency. The bus is always crowded and people living in Bukit Panjang always cant board the bus.
-
Originally posted by chickenlittle2:
sure bo.. 241 loading is rather high between 7.45am to 8.30am..
179 and 241 damn nice to take during PM peak.... so many buses.
But funnily, I realise a trend.
241 comes at about 8 minutes frequency, and a 241 SD always comes 1 minute before the 241 DD, causing the 241 SD to be filled with standing passengers, and the 241 DD to be only filled with about 10 commuters. -
Originally posted by Junyang700:
Can they improve 966's frequency. The bus is always crowded and people living in Bukit Panjang always cant board the bus.
how about a bendy? to make things better? sometimes i see crowded but not that packed though
-
Originally posted by One Harmonius Blend:
how about a bendy? to make things better? sometimes i see crowded but not that packed though
Maybe can use bendy for 963/966 slot instead of current TIB832Z. -
Originally posted by TIB657M:
Maybe can use bendy for 963/966 slot instead of current TIB832Z.Bendies for 963/966 slot, but the problem with 966 is how to deal with the remaining spaces, should there be a bendy
-
966 might need a relook over its allocated schedule. It's so tight tat it cannot allow for the slight daily jam at Woodsville, PIE.
-
Originally posted by Junyang700:
179 and 241 damn nice to take during PM peak.... so many buses.
But funnily, I realise a trend.
241 comes at about 8 minutes frequency, and a 241 SD always comes 1 minute before the 241 DD, causing the 241 SD to be filled with standing passengers, and the 241 DD to be only filled with about 10 commuters.
now adjusting.. Previously, the buses are badly affected by the road works along Pioneer Rd Nth. -
Originally posted by chickenlittle2:
sure bo.. 241 loading is rather high between 7.45am to 8.30am..
not as high as before 7.45am... though all the 179 buses would have already left 241 by 8.15am...
-
no wonder why EWL bet 0730 - 0745 cannot handle Eastbound load at Lakeside & Chinese Garden.
4 mins freq somemore
-
Originally posted by One Harmonius Blend:
how about a bendy? to make things better? sometimes i see crowded but not that packed though
The waiting time is horrible, many are shunning the service when they can take it.
2 full day add on buses would be good.
I rather they take away 4 rigids from 963 and convert it to 2 bendy slots and give the remaining 2 rigids to 966. Same manpower, just that more fuel is burnt with bendy buses being deployed, but it solves the overall problem.
Actually, if 966's frequency is good, it will draw commuters from (Bukit Panjang) services 190, 700, 960 who now take the bus to Whitley Road, alight and cross over to take buses to the East, when it is actually easier to take 966, without having the need to cross the overhead bridge. -
Originally posted by ^tamago^:
not as high as before 7.45am... though all the 179 buses would have already left 241 by 8.15am...
I had seen 1-2 179 buses doing their last trip from BNL.. -
Originally posted by chickenlittle2:
I had seen 1-2 179 buses doing their last trip from BNL..
last trip 7.41am....
-
Originally posted by Junyang700:
The waiting time is horrible, many are shunning the service when they can take it.
2 full day add on buses would be good.
I rather they take away 4 rigids from 963 and convert it to 2 bendy slots and give the remaining 2 rigids to 966. Same manpower, just that more fuel is burnt with bendy buses being deployed, but it solves the overall problem.
Actually, if 966's frequency is good, it will draw commuters from (Bukit Panjang) services 190, 700, 960 who now take the bus to Whitley Road, alight and cross over to take buses to the East, when it is actually easier to take 966, without having the need to cross the overhead bridge.Yahx, the frequency of 966 during off-peak is around 15 to 20 minutes. But do hope that the frequency will be reduced to 10 minutes, but depends on demand during that period.
-
Originally posted by TIB657M:
Yahx, the frequency of 966 during off-peak is around 15 to 20 minutes. But do hope that the frequency will be reduced to 10 minutes, but depends on demand during that period.
At least put 1 or 2 bendies on 966, like 700. -
Not much demand for 169 during weekends unless RP people having big UT during that day. Can also put full rigid fleet from AMDEP side too.
Only workers and RP student need 169 during weekdays.
-
Originally posted by Junyang700:
Can they improve 966's frequency. The bus is always crowded and people living in Bukit Panjang always cant board the bus.
Pls write to PTC. It's the most effective way to get the operator to do something.
-
Originally posted by ^tamago^:
last trip 7.41am....
i had seen last trip starting from close to 8am and buses bunched together.. So imagine the crowd between 7.48am to 8am with no bus at JW St 91 -
Originally posted by TIB1234T:
At least put 1 or 2 bendies on 966, like 700.a couple of bendies may work, but the problem is, is it enough to fill all the people in or not, or just nice.
From what i see, if a bendy is deployed on 966, not all compartments would be packed though