lumix dmc-fz1 and fuji s5000
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i am having a lumix now and i am considering dumping it in exchange for the s5000, which has a manual function.
specs of s5000
10x optical
Shutter,aperature priority or manual operation
fuji lens
55mm lens adapter ( can use teleconvertor and wide angle lens)
SLR-like body
super CCD
3.1MP
matrix, center,spot metering
single.manual and continous focus lock, AF-assist illuminator.
In addition, shutter speed, aperture, white balance, sharpness and colour can be manipulated.
RAW or JPEG file format
shutter 2 to 1/2000
ISO auto(160 to 400) and 200,400,800
uses xD card
no hot-shoe
http://www.steves-digicams.com/2003_reviews/fuji_s5000.html
for my camera it's
shutter speed
8 to 1/2000
automatic control of shutter and aperature
ISO auto(100 to 400) ,100,200,400,
JPEG file format
uses SD card
centre or spot metering
12x zoom
leica dc el-marit lens
abit-slr style body
55mm lens
2.0MP
no hot-shoe
from the reviews i read, s5000 has more obvious purple fringing than my camera, 1 review claimed loads of digital noise, but the CCD so good, so err....
all the sample pics i see, the quality like so-so only. some are even lousy. the things i like abit it is tht the CCD is supposedly good and then it has got manual functions(i dont like being controlled by a computer)
the things abt my cam that i like is the lens and the zoom ( no other digital camera, not DSLR can beat mine to it) so far the pics i take for outdoor dont have much noise only some levels of purple fringing at some pics. but there are some levels of vignetting and barrel distortion ( tmd! knn! )
considering s7000...heh ....got more features than s5000 AND got hot-shoe....
so what u guys think?
s5000 costs 799, price from best denki. lazy to go check things out... -
why are u only considering the s5000? ur s7000 has a hotshoe but i dun think it has a 10x optical zoom reach.
anyway a dslr can reach ur 12x (420mm) most dSLRs have at least a 1.5x crop factor (s2pro, d100) and 1.6x (d30, d60, 10d) which means a 70-300mm lens reaches at least 450mm. with a TC of 1.4x or 2x, it goes even further. of course all this equipment isn't cheap, but the point to illustrate is that going LONG is easy, going wide isn't. i'd be concerned with ur widest setting, with or without wide convertors. as with any convertor, u lose quality, even if quality is negligible, u lose LIGHT. then u add filters etc etc, even more light gone. losing a stop of light in already poor conditions is more than a pain in the ass.. it's more like a poke up ten feet!
okok anyway! i know u've been hunting around for a new cam with manual functions. if u really wanna stick to digicam (meaning not go to dSLR) i would advice u to get one with an EVF. start using the viewfinder to frame ur shots to really improve ur composition and ur handholding techniques. with an EVF u can see all ur settings, shutter speed, aperture, iso value, wb setting, flash on/off/fill etc etc. so u no need to look at ur lcd and look back into an OVF.
another thing that u might wanna think about is ur storage medium XD is very expensive. i'm sure there are advantages of it, but for me i will still stick to CF, cheap and fast enuff. don't forget the s5000 will be shooting 6mp (if u use the super CCD at highest settin) and with more noise at that setting u'll be having bigger files. i'm using a 5mp cam and i get problems with a 512 and 128. of course i shoot heaps on one day, but i have a laptop to d/l. even then it's not all the convenient.
next thing to check is battery. u either get heaps of spare batts, or use AAs, or get a batt pack, if the cam supports it. check out ur power options on the cam b4 u buy, and the costs of these options.
if u are worred about purple fringing and noise, i really need to ask u how u are gonna present ur photos. most of us present them on an online album at a MAX of 800pix on either side. even if u print on 4r, the effects of noise and purple fringing aren't all that apparent in any of the "reputable" brands of cameras. if u CONSTANTLY need to produce 8R or super 8R shots then of course u better be worried. i dunno about u, but i've never printed any shots unless i needed to for OTHER pple.. like my brother's wedding, and the wedding that i just did. other then that i haven't been bothered to get large prints on large format inkjet for those shots that i totally love and want to frame up. not cheap, those prints. otherwise i won't bother printing 4R and storing them in my drawer for the next year.
ok that's all i can think for now. i won't be recommending any brands or models, since i haven't had much experience with other cams except mine. if u wanna buy a 5700, then by all means ask me all the questions about that cam that u want.
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double post
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triple post!
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i dunno lah. it seems the s7000 and yr cam's price very close. i rather get yr cam instead.Originally posted by jOhO:why are u only considering the s5000? ur s7000 has a hotshoe but i dun think it has a 10x optical zoom reach.
s7000 got hot-shoe but no 10x. roughly 6x nia. it's damn expensive.
anyway a dslr can reach ur 12x (420mm) most dSLRs have at least a 1.5x crop factor (s2pro, d100) and 1.6x (d30, d60, 10d) which means a 70-300mm lens reaches at least 450mm. with a TC of 1.4x or 2x, it goes even further. of course all this equipment isn't cheap, but the point to illustrate is that going LONG is easy, going wide isn't. i'd be concerned with ur widest setting, with or without wide convertors. as with any convertor, u lose quality, even if quality is negligible, u lose LIGHT. then u add filters etc etc, even more light gone. losing a stop of light in already poor conditions is more than a pain in the ass.. it's more like a poke up ten feet! i know DSLR can reach further than i do. got teleconvertors and those XL sized lens.
okok anyway! i know u've been hunting around for a new cam with manual functions. if u really wanna stick to digicam (meaning not go to dSLR) i would advice u to get one with an EVF. start using the viewfinder to frame ur shots to really improve ur composition and ur handholding techniques. with an EVF u can see all ur settings, shutter speed, aperture, iso value, wb setting, flash on/off/fill etc etc. so u no need to look at ur lcd and look back into an OVF. actually i am planning to go DSLR after a few years ( at least 3,4 years ) after i have gotten enuf experience with a digicam (either using my lumix then change to another cam like S602 for example or get a s5000 then upgrade) because i dont want to wait so long then learn manual functions.
i know what u mean by the EVF thingy. i agree fully.
another thing that u might wanna think about is ur storage medium XD is very expensive. i'm sure there are advantages of it, but for me i will still stick to CF, cheap and fast enuff. don't forget the s5000 will be shooting 6mp (if u use the super CCD at highest settin) and with more noise at that setting u'll be having bigger files. i'm using a 5mp cam and i get problems with a 512 and 128. of course i shoot heaps on one day, but i have a laptop to d/l. even then it's not all the convenient. the only advantages abt xD is that it's small ( like i care....) capacity of 8GB( like i care...) that's what fuji claim. i dont care. yeah i know the xD thing is expensive,which is a drawback for me.
point noted abt the noise...
next thing to check is battery. u either get heaps of spare batts, or use AAs, or get a batt pack, if the cam supports it. check out ur power options on the cam b4 u buy, and the costs of these options. the options for this cam is rather flexible. got the proprietory batt and accepts AA.not sure abt the batt though.
if u are worred about purple fringing and noise, i really need to ask u how u are gonna present ur photos. most of us present them on an online album at a MAX of 800pix on either side. even if u print on 4r, the effects of noise and purple fringing aren't all that apparent in any of the "reputable" brands of cameras. come to think of it. quite true
if u CONSTANTLY need to produce 8R or super 8R shots then of course u better be worried. i dunno about u, but i've never printed any shots unless i needed to for OTHER pple.. like my brother's wedding, and the wedding that i just did. other then that i haven't been bothered to get large prints on large format inkjet for those shots that i totally love and want to frame up. not cheap, those prints. otherwise i won't bother printing 4R and storing them in my drawer for the next year.
ok that's all i can think for now. i won't be recommending any brands or models, since i haven't had much experience with other cams except mine. if u wanna buy a 5700, then by all means ask me all the questions about that cam that u want.
i just re-read the specs of s7000. shiok leh. i dunno whether to buy s7000 or nikon 5700.. -
hmm lemme go read the s7k specs.. then i post again.Originally posted by bismarck:i dunno lah. it seems the s7000 and yr cam's price very close. i rather get yr cam instead.
i just re-read the specs of s7000. shiok leh. i dunno whether to buy s7000 or nikon 5700.. -
ok i just went thru it.. hmm doesn't look bad at all! if u just talk SPECS..
i like these specs:
- EVF (same as 5700)
- 1cm macro focal range (5700 around 3cm?)
- pretty fast lens 35-210mm f/2.8-3.1 (5700 is 35-280mm f/2.8-4.0)
- continuous drive at 3.3fps 5 frames.. (5700 at 3fps i think and only max 3 frames). i wonder how long it'll take to store those bursts of 5 frames.. hmm mine takes about 4-5 seconds to store after each burst. u just sit there and COUNT the seconds.. it's TOO damn long to wait for the next shot.
- uses AA batts.. good!
- have CF slot... good!
- USB 2!
so how much is it? looks good on paper so far.. i'll keep an ear out for pple commenting on this cam. haven't heard much so far. -
what do u mean by going thru specs it looks ok?Originally posted by jOhO:ok i just went thru it.. hmm doesn't look bad at all! if u just talk SPECS..
i like these specs:
- EVF (same as 5700)
- 1cm macro focal range (5700 around 3cm?)
- pretty fast lens 35-210mm f/2.8-3.1 (5700 is 35-280mm f/2.8-4.0)
- continuous drive at 3.3fps 5 frames.. (5700 at 3fps i think and only max 3 frames). i wonder how long it'll take to store those bursts of 5 frames.. hmm mine takes about 4-5 seconds to store after each burst. u just sit there and COUNT the seconds.. it's TOO damn long to wait for the next shot.
- uses AA batts.. good!
- have CF slot... good!
- USB 2!
so how much is it? looks good on paper so far.. i'll keep an ear out for pple commenting on this cam. haven't heard much so far.
actually for the next cam. i dont need a damn powerful cam. because it will be my 'potty cam' where i will train on composure, shutter and aperature values etc. though the zoom sibei sucky. i have this love for zooming in on ppl from long range using a powerful zoom. which explains my love for my 12x zoom...
somemore take moon pics also convienient. maybe shld borrow a teleconvertor.
i saw a price on cnet.com saying that it costs an est S$1404.
btw how much is yr 5700 ?
also there are some things abt yr 5700 i like leh.
oh yeah. if i not wrong yr cam's CCD records the colour as CMY-something. 4 colours, while my s7000 uses a standard RGB CCD.
yr cam's viewfinder is it electronic or optical ?
it seems that the comparison has become between 5700 and s7000 instead of fz1 and s5000. come to think of it, it seems i am bringing forward my next camera by a few years dont u think? remember i once said i wanna get a 602 a few years later ?
sian....gotta raise money by selling stuff...... -
er.. going thru the specs it looks ok means that i haven't seen or use the cam so that's all i'm basing my conclusions from...
well like i said, getting zoom is easy, i know of someone who's using my cam, (280mm max) adds on the original nikon 1.5x TC and this has a 58mm thread, and still adds on ANOTHER oly tcon (which uses 55mm so he needs to get a step down ring) so in total he gets 280 x 1.5 x 1.7 = 714mm. of course u can continue stacking and i have seen pictures of my cam that's longer than a dSLR with a 70-300 + TC... madness..
anyway for me, i won't be 'fooled' by a large zoom. most of the time u'll find that having heaps of zoom will result in blurry pics due to hand shake. the general rule of thumb is that u need a min shutter speed of 1 on ur focal length. so at 420mm u need a shutter of 1/420 which is pretty fast and u'll only get it under direct sunlight. under the shade, with that long a zoom (probably a smaller aperture) u're gonna have a hard time trying to get that shutter speed, and hence getting underexposure. bump up ur iso and u'll get noise. so... gotta bring a tripod. and with a tripod, all "stealth" mode is gone..
5700 can be had here for around 1600 brand new (maybe just under)? just the cam and standard accessories (1 batt, 1 small crappy cf card etc etc). it's using a CMYG array ccd, but that shouldn't bother you, or i (amatuers). i mean.. it's just a way they record colour, look at the sample pics online to check the colour reproduction. dun use my shots as comparison becos most are photoshopped.. go dpreview to see the unammended shots.
the vf in 5700 is electronic.
in a few years (actually much less!) the 602, and also the 5700 will well be superceeded. anyway i think the s7000 is meant to superceed the 602?
photography is a very expensive hobby. i think u already know that. -
so in actual fact...i am pushing forward my camera by at least a 4 years ? prematurely ? i must consider well...because it will be one of my most expensive mistake. and a big let down for my dad.Originally posted by jOhO:er.. going thru the specs it looks ok means that i haven't seen or use the cam so that's all i'm basing my conclusions from...
well like i said, getting zoom is easy, i know of someone who's using my cam, (280mm max) adds on the original nikon 1.5x TC and this has a 58mm thread, and still adds on ANOTHER oly tcon (which uses 55mm so he needs to get a step down ring) so in total he gets 280 x 1.5 x 1.7 = 714mm. of course u can continue stacking and i have seen pictures of my cam that's longer than a dSLR with a 70-300 + TC... madness..
anyway for me, i won't be 'fooled' by a large zoom. most of the time u'll find that having heaps of zoom will result in blurry pics due to hand shake. the general rule of thumb is that u need a min shutter speed of 1 on ur focal length. so at 420mm u need a shutter of 1/420 which is pretty fast and u'll only get it under direct sunlight. under the shade, with that long a zoom (probably a smaller aperture) u're gonna have a hard time trying to get that shutter speed, and hence getting underexposure. bump up ur iso and u'll get noise. so... gotta bring a tripod. and with a tripod, all "stealth" mode is gone.. point taken. hmm,,,,
5700 can be had here for around 1600 brand new (maybe just under)? just the cam and standard accessories (1 batt, 1 small crappy cf card etc etc). it's using a CMYG array ccd, but that shouldn't bother you, or i (amatuers). i mean.. it's just a way they record colour, look at the sample pics online to check the colour reproduction. dun use my shots as comparison becos most are photoshopped.. go dpreview to see the unammended shots. i need a crash course in photoshop
the vf in 5700 is electronic.
in a few years (actually much less!) the 602, and also the 5700 will well be superceeded. anyway i think the s7000 is meant to superceed the 602? i think u are right, s7000 or 5000 ( errr ? ) is supposed to succeed 602.
photography is a very expensive hobby. i think u already know that. yeap....knew it like the back of my hand... like nikkor's L lens.....buay tahan..3k for a 75 to 300mm lens. 
come to think of it, i showed him some of my photos yesterday, he gave some rather impressive reviews. like maybe u shld include this maybe u shld ......ok..out of point. -
oh yeah there is 1 thing i wanna know abt aperatures and long zooms that has been bugging me.
someone told me abt having a f/2.8 constant being a plus even at long zoom ( my cam is constant 2.
which is good as in u will get light even when u are zooming in at great dist and the object is under the shade. so few cameras have this constant 2.8 thingy. so when pictures are taken, pics will turn out dark because the aperature will become small.
my point is,if i can select the aperature, then why is it still a prob ? -
hmm i dunno how to guage ur "pushing ur camera for 4 years" but i dun think time has anything to do with skill/equipment combo. we've all heard of award winning photographers using disposible cams to take photos but of course that's rare.Originally posted by bismarck:so in actual fact...i am pushing forward my camera by at least a 4 years ? prematurely ? i must consider well...because it will be one of my most expensive mistake. and a big let down for my dad.
come to think of it, i showed him some of my photos yesterday, he gave some rather impressive reviews. like maybe u shld include this maybe u shld ......ok..out of point.
i guess u're talking financial commitment, but then again there are a few rich kids out there that own dslrs when they are 18 becos they CAN, would u say that they're premature in thier photographic related endeavours? anyway mostly the term "buy the best equipment you can afford" usually works will for me. anyway 4 years is a long time. if u buy a s7000 now, 4 years later u won't be able to find one. 
hey it's good that ur father supports ur hobby, of course not just financially. and it's also a good thing that u start young!
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it will be good if he financially backs my hobby....problem is...he doesnt.Originally posted by jOhO:hmm i dunno how to guage ur "pushing ur camera for 4 years" but i dun think time has anything to do with skill/equipment combo. we've all heard of award winning photographers using disposible cams to take photos but of course that's rare.
i guess u're talking financial commitment, but then again there are a few rich kids out there that own dslrs when they are 18 becos they CAN, would u say that they're premature in thier photographic related endeavours? anyway mostly the term "buy the best equipment you can afford" usually works will for me. anyway 4 years is a long time. if u buy a s7000 now, 4 years later u won't be able to find one.
hey it's good that ur father supports ur hobby, of course not just financially. and it's also a good thing that u start young!
my lumix was bought with my own money....1 year 3 months of waiting and saving..... my precious cam...will always remember this junk....
btw there is 1 guy in my club ( heard he is rather pro..) owns a EOS 10D. there are also 1 with either a 602 or a EOS 30. damn pro....see the EOS 30 i buay tahan liaoz.
sian.... -
eheheh like that sian liow.
wait till i get my hands on a d2h to even TOUCH it i think i'll be orgas x 1000000
go check out the specs on the d2h... one spec is enuff to kill me:
8 fps / max 40 frames jpg, 25 frames NEF...
not to mention new LBCAST technology and blah blah... -
funny thing is....i just happened to see the D2H model on dpreview for the first time. going to take a look on the specs though...Originally posted by jOhO:eheheh like that sian liow.
wait till i get my hands on a d2h to even TOUCH it i think i'll be orgas x 1000000
go check out the specs on the d2h... one spec is enuff to kill me:
8 fps / max 40 frames jpg, 25 frames NEF...
not to mention new LBCAST technology and blah blah...