MAF abandon Steyr after 15-year service
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It is a marginally better weapon. About 1% more reliable as proven by the lab tests.Originally posted by Shotgun:Sure, Buy me Dragonskin first.
Besides, the 5.56s reduced wounding from shorter barrelled weapons is not being contested. Just the M4 being adopted as the "next generation" standard infantry issue.
I'd take a 416 over an M4 any day. It IS a better weapon.
And the HK416 doesn't solve the short barrel problem does it?
Give it a rest.
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Marginally?! 1%?? Where do you get your numbers man... Official US Army tests? Official US Army tests also show Interceptor to be superior to Dragonskin.
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Pardon my youthful 20yr old...but doesn't the 416 come in varied barrel lengths ranging from 10" to 20"? Say I take a m4 lower and mate it to a 20" 416 upper, doesn't that make my 416 more accurate than say a M4 with a 14.5" barrel?Originally posted by chino65:And the HK416 doesn't solve the short barrel problem does it?
Just my 2 cents...cuz essentially you still get a package that's shorter than the run of the mill M16A4 that's say 39" long? -
Talking about the M4, not BA. Do the math.Originally posted by Shotgun:Marginally?! 1%?? Where do you get your numbers man... Official US Army tests? Official US Army tests also show Interceptor to be superior to Dragonskin. -
The test was to recommend replacing a short M4 with a equally short HK416.Originally posted by SpecOps87:Pardon my youthful 20yr old...but doesn't the 416 come in varied barrel lengths ranging from 10" to 20"? Say I take a m4 lower and mate it to a 20" 416 upper, doesn't that make my 416 more accurate than say a M4 with a 14.5" barrel?
Just my 2 cents...cuz essentially you still get a package that's shorter than the run of the mill M16A4 that's say 39" long? -
i think even if MAF select the M4A1 as the standard infantry rifle, it does not mean that they won't buy the HK416 for selected units
still the same bullet, but saves a lot of money than buying HK416 for all line units (Norway bought 8,200 for like $2000 USD each) -
I think if not for the license manufacturing and export deal with Colt, MY wouldn't have necessarily picked the M4.Originally posted by zagan:i think even if MAF select the M4A1 as the standard infantry rifle, it does not mean that they won't buy the HK416 for selected units
still the same bullet, but saves a lot of money than buying HK416 for all line units (Norway bought 8,200 for like $2000 USD each)
There are so many piston M16's out there from other manufacturers. And the HK 416 is of course one of the cheaper ones. -
Yah I know...but you bro...there's alot of ruckus about the M4, HK416 etc...being not so accurate cuz they have a short barrel...den say that still want it to be short...its like a holy grail man...I mean the two camps...1 side want short weapon, the other accuracy. So you make a M4 lower with a 20"...you get a short weapon with no lack of accuracy.Originally posted by chino65:The test was to recommend replacing a short M4 with a equally short HK416. -
Actually, there isn't much of an accuracy problem with the M4 at all.Originally posted by SpecOps87:Yah I know...but you bro...there's alot of ruckus about the M4, HK416 etc...being not so accurate cuz they have a short barrel...den say that still want it to be short...its like a holy grail man...I mean the two camps...1 side want short weapon, the other accuracy. So you make a M4 lower with a 20"...you get a short weapon with no lack of accuracy.
I just read in a magazine the US Army combat shooting team (for competition) hits targets out to 400yd and beyond with a scoped milspec M4.
The problem had always been its alleged lack of killing power, and now - reliability.
In a sense I agree with what you are saying. It is no point replacing a short barrel M4 with a slightly more reliable short-barrel HK416, both firing the same low-energy round cos of the short barrel.
The current 5.56 round used by NATO is designed for 20inch barrel. So on a 14.5inch barrel it apparently lacks power for what is already not a very powerful round to begin with.
Some people suggests that there needs to e a 5.56 round designed for the 14.5inch barrel using faster burning propellant etc. Or a different bullet weight. -
The 5.56 issue has been around for a long time. The round wounds well due to fragmentation, but also due to that, lacks power to penetrate. What penetrates are usually fragments of the rounds, that no doubt hurt, but lack the ability to kill.
However, its hard to imagine NATO stepping away from 5.56 and adopting a new round-type. They've got stockpiles full of them....
Found a good site on the 5.56 though. Very interesting information, like the maximum penetration occurs at 200m, and at ranges of less than 25m, the round doesn't penetrate well.
http://www.sgforums.com/?action=post&thread_id=289998 -
and at ranges of less than 25m, the round doesn't penetrate well.
doesnt peneterate what exactly? face? or bullet proof vest?.....please be clear about this, we dont want seeing NS kid shoving their face infront of an enemy M4 because of that statement. LOL. -
Ooops, my bad. I pasted the wrong link! Haha
Here's the link. Check it out!
http://www.inetres.com/gp/military/infantry/rifle/556mm_ammo.html
Everything you need to know about 5.56 x45s. [/url] -
latest news....M4A1 will be given to its UCIS team and the regular infantry will use M16A4
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MAF?Originally posted by tankfanatic:latest news....M4A1 will be given to its UCIS team and the regular infantry will use M16A4
What is UCIS? -
Scouts?
UCIS = Unit Combat Intelligence Squad -
I'm sure that there's like 5 people altogether in UCIS...Originally posted by kotay:Scouts?
UCIS = Unit Combat Intelligence Squad
So what are they going to do with the shxtload of M4a1 they are about to manufacture?
And are they gonna import M16A4 or manufacture them? -
UCIS is an organic of any company size infantry...only 5-6 people ..they were not special forces...usually these are people who have extremely good tracking and jungle skill...if a company dosnt have one they can borrow from a different coy or regiment.
ala..these dudes basically tracker and scout who sniff around the FEBA...some time callinf arty...but mostly just reporting....thas why they use m4a1 with suppressor -
maybe the rest of the M4 they give to the mech ? dunno lah cannot speculate.
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I kinda understaood from the name what they are and roughly how many people, I was from S2.Originally posted by tankfanatic:UCIS is an organic of any company size infantry...only 5-6 people ..they were not special forces...usually these are people who have extremely good tracking and jungle skill...if a company dosnt have one they can borrow from a different coy or regiment.
ala..these dudes basically tracker and scout who sniff around the FEBA...some time callinf arty...but mostly just reporting....thas why they use m4a1 with suppressor
But this throws the whole M4 manufacture into question. No one, especially here in SEA, gonna make/buy new rifles JUST for mechanics.
Can you point me to a link or quote the source of this info? -
the term UCIS was only used during the Malayan Emergency right? I don't think they are called UCIS nowadays
at least thats what i get googling, heh -
magz tempur...120,000 m16a4 and m4a1....Originally posted by chino65:I kinda understaood from the name what they are and roughly how many people, I was from S2.
But this throws the whole M4 manufacture into question. No one, especially here in SEA, gonna make/buy new rifles JUST for mechanics.
Can you point me to a link or quote the source of this info?No one, especially here in SEA, gonna make/buy new rifles JUST for mechanics
lol... how many mechanics? 11,000...phew..[/quote] -
its still there..the last info that i knew about this unit is the dude who died during the freak arm heist...in Sauk. Hes a UCIS.Originally posted by zagan:the term UCIS was only used during the Malayan Emergency right? I don't think they are called UCIS nowadays
at least thats what i get googling, heh -
What? So the Entire MAF is gonna adopt M855 ammunition for the M-16A4s and M4s?
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what the heck is M855?Originally posted by Shotgun:What? So the Entire MAF is gonna adopt M855 ammunition for the M-16A4s and M4s? -
A newer 5.56mm round that has different ballistic qualities from the one we use in SAF, which is M193 IIRC. Bullet size and weight, and propellant is different.Originally posted by tankfanatic:what the heck is M855?
Can google wah...