Joining a Foreign Legion
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A foreign legion is a regular military force consisting of foreigners who are not normally subjects of the country that employs them. Many countries employed such foreign units prior to the twentieth century. The only remaining ones are those of France, Spain, and Israel; but the phrase foreign legion in English generally refers to the French one.
* French Foreign Legion
* Spanish Foreign Legion
* Israeli Machal
The Netherlands maintained such a force - "KNIL", acronym for Koninklijk Nederlands Indisch Leger or the Royal Netherlands Indies Army. Formed by royal decree on March 10, 1830, it served until the granting of Independence to Indonesia in 1949.
Other nations have maintained military forces whose members are not citizens but recruited from a single foreign state. The best known are the Gurkha regiments of the present British and Indian armies and the Swiss Guard at the Vatican. Additionally, the Wehrmacht and the Waffen SS raised numerous foreign legions during World War Two.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_legion
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Just for some background.I'm thinking of perhaps serving with the Israeli Machal.I know that Singapore has a ruling against it,but I am 'crazy' enough to want to serve with a foreign unit.
I would like to serve some time in a military that has an actual chance at combat ops,rather than serving in a military whose main goal is deterrence and posturing.
I entertained thoughts of joining the Spanish or French Foreign Legions,but figured that the Israeli Machal is a better balance, at 3 years rather than 5 years or more with the other services.
What do you think?
I am already aware of the Official Security Act and the restrictions it places on Singaporeans serving as 'foreign mercenaries' or as professionals in foreign militaries,but I do not really give a damn.It's probably been done and it is not as if they will bother prosecute me.I never served in a sensitive post,but as all Singaporean soldiers,we are aware of sensitive information relevant to our posts and appointments.I just want your honest opinions and advice -
haha, somehow I always had the impression you were Malay... maybe from your handle...
Anyway, isn't Israel a bad choice? Messy guerilla warfare, schoolgirl suicide bombers and all that nasty stuff. -
TS,have you served your NS yet?
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I can give nothing. I can only give honesty that I know nothing about the History of Organiations of Miltary Forces. What ruling are they protecting. And what forces.
So far Isreal is a Military that protect their people against threat. Just like Singapore Armed Forces. For Singapore cases is that we are protectinf the airspace, water costal. against bigger threat from bigger country. -
That's why he want's to see actionOriginally posted by hudax1:I can give nothing. I can only give honesty that I know nothing about the History of Organiations of Miltary Forces. What ruling are they protecting. And what forces.
So far Isreal is a Military that protect their people against threat. Just like Singapore Armed Forces. For Singapore cases is that we are protectinf the airspace, water costal. against bigger threat from bigger country.
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Actually I would love to see action too, before I am too old to fight.
And in a twisted way, I hope someone would try and invade us. that way, we don't have any troublesome grey areas with morals etc. Simply repel and punish invaders with absolute force.
After all our training, our weapon acquisition, I'm kinda spoiling for a fight.
But I hope the fight doesn't come too late. Imagine when you're in your sixties or seventies and all you can do is run and hide instead of fight. -
i doubt it'll happen. if it happens, then many people will already deem SAF a failure. they exist mainly to deter.Originally posted by moca:Actually I would love to see action too, before I am too old to fight.
And in a twisted way, I hope someone would try and invade us. that way, we don't have any troublesome grey areas with morals etc. Simply repel and punish invaders with absolute force.
After all our training, our weapon acquisition, I'm kinda spoiling for a fight.
But I hope the fight doesn't come too late. Imagine when you're in your sixties or seventies and all you can do is run and hide instead of fight. -
Be prepared to be refused entry into Singapore.
Technically there has not be a precedent that was made public, but I wager the Govt frowns on such involvement. -
Originally posted by moca:Actually I would love to see action too, before I am too old to fight.
And in a twisted way, I hope someone would try and invade us. that way, we don't have any troublesome grey areas with morals etc. Simply repel and punish invaders with absolute force.
After all our training, our weapon acquisition, I'm kinda spoiling for a fight.
But I hope the fight doesn't come too late. Imagine when you're in your sixties or seventies and all you can do is run and hide instead of fight.
Great minds think alike... -
To the ignorant, Sarduakar are elite troops of the Corrino Emperor from the fictional Dune universe. Sending in 1 legion(approximately 10,000 men) is enough to subdue a rebelling planet. Technically, such troops are not allowed to give quarter nor recieve quarter. Shows that the TS can be a fanatic combatant.Originally posted by moca:haha, somehow I always had the impression you were Malay... maybe from your handle...
Anyway, isn't Israel a bad choice? Messy guerilla warfare, schoolgirl suicide bombers and all that nasty stuff. -
Yes I have.Currently,my rank,like anyone else who has served has,if I am activated,would be Cpl(Ns).Originally posted by Marco_Simone:TS,have you served your NS yet?
I served in the Signal Platoon, HQ Coy,35 SCE,Seletar Camp.
And yes,I DO want to see action.As for reentry,well,this is my home.I gave them 2 years of my life in service.I am a loyal citizen,who with his personal ideals wants to serve a cause he feels is worthwhile.
Given that I greatly respect the Israeli's and Jews as a culture,as much as I respect Chinese and Indians,where my ancestry comes from,I would be quite happy to serve.
The Singapore government should have no problems with one of its nationals willing to serve in the armed forces of a close ally,and who service would NOT compromise ops security.
I never served in a sensitive position,and I remain a Singaporean citizen first and foremost.Meaning that I would not divulge sensitive information,which I had limited access to anyway.
I basically just want to get a chance to see the reality of it.Whether I regret it or not is something I will find out once I do it. -
Just curious...if you are unemployed and say u're a CDO trained Medic/Signaller/Sniper and you approach Blackwater to work as a PMC in Iraq or Afghan. Will you be considered a foreign mercenary? Considering the fact that BW is actually a business entity rather then a national entity
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Go to the middle east as an american defense contractor.
There might be restrictions on nationality though, and being a draftee for 2 years might mean you are still under qualified. -
Maybe not just american companies. Here are a few more from wiki.
* 3D Global Solutions (Website)[20]
* Aedion
* Alpha Point Security (Website) Armed Security, UAV-Intelligence (ISR) and Consulting... defense against piracy, terrorists and rebels.
* AQMI Strategy Corp
* Black- Op's (pmc) (Website)
* Blackwater USA (Website)
* Braddock Dunn & McDonald (BDM) long-established defense contractor purchased in mid-1990s by TRW and onsold to Northrop Grumman in December 2002
* C3 Defense, Inc. (Website)
* CACI - California Analysis Center, Incorporated
* Critical Intervention Services paramilitary Security Agency based out of Clearwater, Fl.
* Berodt Dynamics, Defence contractor from Iowa
* Defion Internacional, (Website)
* DynCorp, (Website)
* Eastern Cross
* Elite Security Corps
* ITT Corporation
* ISCS International
* International Security Instructors, (Website)
* Kellogg Brown and Root - Division of Halliburton
* Landmine Sourcing - Global PMC Recruiters (Website)
* Military Professional Resources Inc. (MPRI) (Website)
* ManTech International Corporation
* Northbridge Services Group
* Northrop Grumman
* Overwatch Protection Solutions International, (Website)
* Paratus World Wide Protection, (Website)
* Ronin Worldwide Executive Protection, LLC, (Website)
* Raytheon
* SCG International Risk (Website)
* Sharp End International (Website) - who use mainly Australian and New Zealand ex-special forces instructors
* SkyLink USA, affiliated with SkyLink Aviation [21]
* SOS Temps, Inc founded by former Navy Seal Richard Marcinko.
* Spartan Consulting Group (Website)3
* Tactical Response Services paramilitary Security Agency based out of Tampa, Fl.
* Titan Corporation
* Top Cat Marine Security (Website)
* Triple Canopy, Inc. (Website)
* Vinnell Corporation
* VIP Investigations & Protective Services Inc. (Website)
* EUBSA BV Inc. STOP units - Special Tactics and OPerations (Website)
* Pathfinder Security Services
* Adson Holdings, (registered in Guernsey) – owners of Sandline International
* Aegis Defence Services, (Website)
* AKE Group, (Website)
* Armor Group, (Website)
* Black- Op's (pmc), (website)
* Branch Energy Ltd, (registered in the Isle of Man)
* Corporate Warriors - Division of the Brillstein Security Group, (Website)
* Defence Services Ltd,
* Erinys International, joint South Africa-Britain
* Gurkha Security Guards, (registered in Guernsey)
* Hart Security Limited
* Hostile Control Tactics, (Website)
* Sandline International (ceased operations on April 16, 2004)
* Plaza 107
* Securiforce
* Black- Op's (pmc) Private Military Solutions Division, Cyprus([2])
* Diamond Works, Canada (purchased Branch Energy in 1996)
* Executive Outcomes, South Africa (ceased operations on January 1, 1999)
* Levdan - Israel
* Meteoric Tactical Solutions, South Africa
* Olive Group (Website)
* Omega Group - Norway
* Omega Security Solutions -South Africa
* Sharp End International (website)
* Strategic Resources Corporation, South Africa
* OMEGA SERVICES pmc- Russia/Ukraine. Ex- Russian SpN VMF, PDSS, Marines personnel. (Website)
* Praesidia Defence, Germany (Website)
* Greystone Ltd (Website) -
Preferably special forces/elite infantry background...Originally posted by SpecOps87:Just curious...if you are unemployed and say u're a CDO trained Medic/Signaller/Sniper and you approach Blackwater to work as a PMC in Iraq or Afghan. Will you be considered a foreign mercenary? Considering the fact that BW is actually a business entity rather then a national entity -
First off,I do not want to serve as a mercenary.Secondly,I do not come from an elite infantry/special forces background,as can be seen in my unit.I was a Signaller in a combat engineer unit.
Thirdly,I do not want to serve American interests.Simple as that. -
Originally posted by Sardaukar:
It should not be a problem, if you have finished your reservist obligations. Because the Legions will not let you go to come back and serve your reservist obligations, unless you can declare a nice cover employment address in Spain or France for your exit permit.
First off,I do [b]not want to serve as a mercenary.Secondly,I do not come from an elite infantry/special forces background,as can be seen in my unit.I was a Signaller in a combat engineer unit.
Thirdly,I do not want to serve American interests.Simple as that.[/b]
Frankly, I believe that if you want to do so, by all means, cover your ass. It's a grey area because you have not RODed.
As for PMCs, it's often easier because you are not a mercenary to a foreign state, but a security employee. And not all PMCs serve in Iraq. Some serve in the Congo or Central Africa. -
http://www.mahal2000.com/about/non-Jewish-volunteer.htm
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just dun understand why some ppl want to put their lives on the line to serve a foreign army/nation/politician selfish agenda. it's not like your involvement can make the world a better place or make you a better person(i dun think taking killing another person who's not a threat to your life/country makes you a more compassionate person). yes you may say it is for the experience. but will this experience make your life more enriching? as in, killing another person with no reason(it's not like that person you killed is a threat to your life/country) will not make you a happier person or someone who treasure life more but makes you more like a murderer.
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And who are you to question them as well? And pulling security in Fallujah does not make you a murderer.Originally posted by ah_kwang:just dun understand why some ppl want to put their lives on the line to serve a foreign army/nation/politician selfish agenda. it's not like your involvement can make the world a better place or make you a better person(i dun think taking killing another person who's not a threat to your life/country makes you a more compassionate person). yes you may say it is for the experience. but will this experience make your life more enriching? as in, killing another person with no reason(it's not like that person you killed is a threat to your life/country) will not make you a happier person or someone who treasure life more but makes you more like a murderer.
Murder is premediated killing for it's own sake, or for the sake of pleasure. Pulling security or fighting for certain ideals is far more different. Please get that distinction clear.
There are ex-Singaporeans serving in the US Army Reserve because they feel that they have to give back their new nation what it has given them. The notion of service to a state or ideals is something not every layman in Singapore can understand.
Some people have their own calling in life. Let's respect that even if you cannot agree. -
Originally posted by Sardaukar:
So what do you wanna do there?
First off,I do [b]not want to serve as a mercenary[/b] -
He wants to improve his combat qualifications and realistically, that's the only way out.Originally posted by wonderamazement:So what do you wanna do there?
If my friend were to take the informed decision to move to the States and join the Marines, I would support him too, as long as he knows what he wants to do. -
You pay might be good for a foreign legion but the life's suck..
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Originally posted by Sardaukar:
I'm sure the FFL need signallers. Or you can be a infantry radioman.
First off,I do [b]not want to serve as a mercenary.Secondly,I do not come from an elite infantry/special forces background,as can be seen in my unit.I was a Signaller in a combat engineer unit.
Thirdly,I do not want to serve American interests.Simple as that.[/b]
But why be discriminating about American interests?
On one hand, you say you want to join a foreign army... and then at the same time you want to be picky about your battles?
If you are going to have qualms or moral issues, stay civvi.
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Informed decision? Goodness. Who's battles will he be fighting for?Originally posted by LazerLordz:He wants to improve his combat qualifications and realistically, that's the only way out.
If my friend were to take the informed decision to move to the States and join the Marines, I would support him too, as long as he knows what he wants to do.