GW-1
-
I was reading a book on the engagement during Desert Storm before the Coalition ground forces move into Kuwait and Iraq.
Three Iraqi Divisions moved into Saudi Arabia. There was a story of an engagement of TOW and 25mm Marine Corps LAVs against Iraqi T-62 and T-55.
typically the MC SOP is to standoff and engage enemy with TOWs. Howeve due to nature of the ground and the need to cover the extraction of recon teams, they are forced to approach at short range and engage tanks with 25mm rounds.
The 25mm rounds are bouncing off the armour of the Iraqi tanks. Just imagine if it is the AMX-13, Our tank crews will be sacrificed in vain. 25mm rounds will probably go right through the turret. -
Originally posted by spencer99
No need 25mm just the 0.5" can do the job already!
The 25mm rounds are bouncing off the armour of the Iraqi tanks. Just imagine if it is the AMX-13, Our tank crews will be sacrificed in vain. 25mm rounds will probably go right through the turret.
-
are you talking about the Battle of Khafji?
Actually there were quite a few interesting tank battles during the first gulf war. Gosh I can't remember which battle was it that the outnumbered yanks outfought the iraqi and spearheaded too deep in... -
Yes, the battle of Khafji.Originally posted by chillycraps:are you talking about the Battle of Khafji?
Actually there were quite a few interesting tank battles during the first gulf war. Gosh I can't remember which battle was it that the outnumbered yanks outfought the iraqi and spearheaded too deep in...
The book i read is about the recon marines that were on the frontline and was surrounded by Iraqis.
Apparently there is on LAV-TOW that was destroyed by another LAV-TOW. and a LAV-25mm that was struck by a Air Force A10...
Friendly Fire.... -
Though I found it quite unbelievable, I remember some accounts that actually said that the 25mm guns damaged/destroyed Iraqi MBTs.
Is it possible?
Though bear in mind the chain gun on Apache is supposed to have some "tank-busting" capabilities, too. -
Wrong post...
-
But the Apache will most likely hit the top.Originally posted by moca:Though I found it quite unbelievable, I remember some accounts that actually said that the 25mm guns damaged/destroyed Iraqi MBTs.
Is it possible?
Though bear in mind the chain gun on Apache is supposed to have some "tank-busting" capabilities, too.
Anyway some soviet tanks had their fuel lines snaking around the turrent so i wont be surprise if they went boom to a 25mm -
friendly fire is a US martial tradition ...Originally posted by spencer99:Yes, the battle of Khafji.
The book i read is about the recon marines that were on the frontline and was surrounded by Iraqis.
Apparently there is on LAV-TOW that was destroyed by another LAV-TOW. and a LAV-25mm that was struck by a Air Force A10...
Friendly Fire....
-
Friendly fire has happened to absolutely every army that had ever gone to war. Who's to say we won't if we ever go to war? So don't laugh at others.
-
the Bushmaster 30mms on the BXII can pierce certain armour, depending on the ammo.
Do note that the Americans use depleted uranium rounds. -
Pardon my youthful ignorance, but how much significance does using DU rounds affect the ballistic capabilities of the weapon?Originally posted by LazerLordz:the Bushmaster 30mms on the BXII can pierce certain armour, depending on the ammo.
Do note that the Americans use depleted uranium rounds.
And yeah, Friendly Fire is just as deadly as Enemy Fire. -
Unfortunately, moca is right. Being killed by your own forces by mistake is much worst than dying in the hands of the enemy.Originally posted by moca:Friendly fire has happened to absolutely every army that had ever gone to war. Who's to say we won't if we ever go to war? So don't laugh at others. -
Yeah my friend bought it by blue-on-blue during ATEC, by his own OC no less.
I've heard cases of Bradleys managing to knock out T-72s with their 25mm cannon, though I wonder if it is really possible. A sustained barrage of 25mm might cause the crew within to bail (esp. given the notorious quality of Iraqi tanker) as the noise and shock from the barrage might make them think that the tank has taken all it can take. In WW2 this Sherman tank crew "knocked out" two Tigers by using WP shells on them. While causing no damage the smoke from the shells were sucked into the tank convincing the crews that the tank was on fire and they bailed! Too bad that Sherman was knocked out soon after.
Another theory is that while the frontal armor of the T-72 is good, there are several weak spots where the 25mm can find, and a barrage of 25mm is sure of foul any optics and the like on the MBT, so it can be quite useful. A flank shot or rear might have a fair chance of taking the tank out, so that is possible as well. -
The 25mm round might have been able to suppress the tank crew quite a bit. Can u imagine targeting the main gun under constant barrage of the 25mm?
THe DU makes the projectile denser so that it can actually penetrate the armor...
Not much difference in the ballistic qualities i think. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depleted_Uranium#Ammunition -
In WW2 this Sherman tank crew "knocked out" two Tigers by using WP shells on them. While causing no damage the smoke from the shells were sucked into the tank convincing the crews that the tank was on fire and they bailed!
Haha...Yea...Read this in the Citizen Soilders book... Apparently after being hit By WP (White Phosphorous) Rounds...They thought that their Tiger Tanks were on fire or had been hit... -
I've heard cases of Bradleys managing to knock out T-72s with their 25mm cannon, though I wonder if it is really possible. A sustained barrage of 25mm might cause the crew within to bail
The T-72 Was a Crew Killer...Normally Once Hit... It had a Tendency to Catch Fire... I believe The T-72 Has a Crew of Three...And has an Auto Loader for its Rounds... And has good NBC protection -
usually in western tank designs, the ammunition storage area has panels that blow outwards to prevent internal explosion and cook off. Russian tank designs don't have this feature, so in movies we always see the whole round round turret of T-series fly off.Originally posted by Seth35:The T-72 Was a Crew Killer...Normally Once Hit... It had a Tendency to Catch Fire... I believe The T-72 Has a Crew of Three...And has an Auto Loader for its Rounds... And has good NBC protection -
usually in western tank designs, the ammunition storage area has panels that blow outwards to prevent internal explosion and cook off. Russian tank designs don't have this feature, so in movies we always see the whole round round turret of T-series fly off.
Was watching a documentary on the 1st gulf war...No the T-72 didn't blow its whole rounded top off...it just burned from the inside... -
Aye, I did see some pics of brewed up T- tanks with their turret seperated. It depends I guess, on if the ammo took a bad hit (like a direct APFSDS hit) and all went up in one shot or if it was all cooking off slowly.Originally posted by Seth35:Was watching a documentary on the 1st gulf war...No the T-72 didn't blow its whole rounded top off...it just burned from the inside...
I heard somes stories of the 120mm APFSDS managing to penetrate two T-72s and destroy them both. There was this bogged down M-1A1 that got jumped by three T-72s, was hit several times with no damage and took them all out. Hai, poor Iraqi tankers... at least they're not using AMX-13. -
Haha, sure is a comforting fact for our tankees? But really, more should be spent in the form of crew survivability.Originally posted by SingaporeTyrannosaur:I heard somes stories of the 120mm APFSDS managing to penetrate two T-72s and destroy them both. There was this bogged down M-1A1 that got jumped by three T-72s, was hit several times with no damage and took them all out. Hai, poor Iraqi tankers... at least they're not using AMX-13. -
I heard somes stories of the 120mm APFSDS managing to penetrate two T-72s and destroy them both. There was this bogged down M-1A1 that got jumped by three T-72s, was hit several times with no damage and took them all out. Hai, poor Iraqi tankers... at least they're not using AMX-13.
I am sure Singapore has some counter measures for out AMX-13s ?
For example Add on Armour ?
But than again forgive me for my ignorance...I havent been reading up lately...
-
Ah, I was wondering the same thing too on a previous AMX13 thread. But nope, AMX13 does not have the capability to fit on Reactive Armour.Originally posted by Seth35:I am sure Singapore has some counter measures for out AMX-13s ?
For example Add on Armour ?
But than again forgive me for my ignorance...I havent been reading up lately... -
T-72 has it's ammo surrounded by fuel so......heh big boom
-
The Twardies of our northern friends ain't your father's T-72 ....
so we mustn't get too complacent eh ...
-
Reactive armour or not i can't say because even though the SM1 is clearly on its way out of service some things are not meant for the public forum.Originally posted by SpecOps87:Ah, I was wondering the same thing too on a previous AMX13 thread. But nope, AMX13 does not have the capability to fit on Reactive Armour.
However, i may add that external add-ons can be done.