American Soldiers Flees and left Truck Driver to die.

• scabstermooch

  29 Sep 06, 17:04

  http://news.bbc.co.uk/nolavconsole/ukfs_news/hi/newsid_5390000/newsid_5390300/bb_rm_5390306.stm
  
  My gawd... the humvee commander lost his way, then leaves an unarmed civvy truck driver to fend for himself.
  
  The US army says that the humvee fought back bravely. What a load of poo.
  
  PS: They were from the virginia national guard.
  
  
• |-|05|

  29 Sep 06, 18:56

  I say arm the truck drivers and put bloody troops in the trucks.
• Texcoco II

  29 Sep 06, 20:21

  Originally posted by scabstermooch:

  http://news.bbc.co.uk/nolavconsole/ukfs_news/hi/newsid_5390000/newsid_5390300/bb_rm_5390306.stm
  
  My gawd... the humvee commander lost his way, then leaves an unarmed civvy truck driver to fend for himself.
  
  The US army says that the humvee fought back bravely. What a load of poo.
  
  PS: They were from the virginia national guard.
  
  

  I thought American soldiers are brave? They dun show fear when they drop bombs on the ground with their fighter-bombers
• kwlee

  29 Sep 06, 20:24

  wow at that behaviour.
• beavan

  29 Sep 06, 22:22

  Originally posted by Texcoco II:

  I thought American soldiers are brave? They dun show fear when they drop bombs on the ground with their fighter-bombers

  sometimes the bravest people are also scared
• Shotgun

  30 Sep 06, 00:33

  This is pure cowardice by the commanding officer leading the convoy. His mistake brought them to that situation, and he abandoned the convoy he was supposed to escort, causing the deaths of the civilian convoy drivers.
  
  He oughta be court martialed.
• Fatum

  30 Sep 06, 00:35

  
  it happens to tbe best of men I suppose ...
  
  it's easy to sit behind a computer screen and snipe at them ...
  
  but when it happens to us in real life, who's to know who will run and who will fight ? ....
• Hellraiza

  30 Sep 06, 00:54

  WTF!? This is definitely one of the most disturbing videos i've ever seen.
• scabstermooch

  30 Sep 06, 01:20

  Originally posted by Fatum:

  it happens to tbe best of men I suppose ...
  
  it's easy to sit behind a computer screen and snipe at them ...
  
  but when it happens to us in real life, who's to know who will run and who will fight ? ....

  The difference is that I did not sign up to be a soldier; i did not make a representation that I will be steadfast when the shit hits the fan.
  
  If you cannot do the job, don't put on the uniform and collect the pay. If you do so, then expect to be judged as a soldier.
  
  
• Fatum

  30 Sep 06, 08:54

  Originally posted by scabstermooch:

  The difference is that I did not sign up to be a soldier; i did not make a representation that I will be steadfast when the shit hits the fan.
  
  If you cannot do the job, don't put on the uniform and collect the pay. If you do so, then expect to be judged as a soldier.
  
  

  but that's precisely my point ... it's so easy for anyone to swear or make representations to be steadfast and do our duty or whatever .... but these are just words ....
  
  how anyone would react under fire, that's not something one can predict before hand I suppose ...
• SBS3625D

  30 Sep 06, 19:05

  It sure is tough to be brave. My heart goes out to the drivers.
• sgboy2004

  30 Sep 06, 19:32

  mi condolence
• Manager433

  30 Sep 06, 19:47

  Here's one of the clips showing the American first to flee leaving the unarmed and hapless truck drivers to fend for themselves.
  
  http://www.flurl.com/item/Halliburto...Iraq__u_186356
• Pitot

  1 Oct 06, 03:40

  Rest in peace. And Once again thank you to all those working their lives off in Iraq trying to make a better future.
• moca

  1 Oct 06, 05:54

  In the heat of the moment, it is hard to say what's right or what's wrong. Probably, the briefing for those soldiers did not prepare them well to react to ambush action.
  
  Inexperience is evident.
  
  But until the whole truth is revealed, it is hard to say if the men in the armed vehicle did what they were trained to do or they panicked and bugged out. Or maybe in the confusion they were racing off to where they thought the battle was.
  
  
• Fatum

  1 Oct 06, 06:29

  
  hold your fire guys, actually, I just remembered something ...
  
  think back to your NS days ... what's the drill for a convoy ambush ? ...
  
  "DON'T STOP !", right ? ... cos if you stop in the kill zone, you're dead .... drive through out of the kill zone if possible, regroup, then come back on the offensive ... you only mount an immediae offensive action when you're trapped in the kill zone ...
  
  it's different from the ambush drills for the infantry and other foot grunts eh ...
  
  so perhaps what those soldiers did wasn't that wrong after all .... though they did seem to take their sweet time coming back ... called and waited for a QRF perhaps ....
  
  
• scabstermooch

  1 Oct 06, 12:09

  Originally posted by Fatum:

  hold your fire guys, actually, I just remembered something ...
  
  think back to your NS days ... what's the drill for a convoy ambush ? ...
  
  "DON'T STOP !", right ? ... cos if you stop in the kill zone, you're dead .... drive through out of the kill zone if possible, regroup, then come back on the offensive ... you only mount an immediae offensive action when you're trapped in the kill zone ...
  
  it's different from the ambush drills for the infantry and other foot grunts eh ...
  
  so perhaps what those soldiers did wasn't that wrong after all .... though they did seem to take their sweet time coming back ... called and waited for a QRF perhaps ....
  
  

  So what is the point of having an escort then? Plus, he was there for 40 mins. They need to regroup and have a snatch squad or something to go for the truck drivers.
  
  Imo, it is criminal that Halliburton refused to up-armor the trucks, and allow their drivers to carry arms. The argument that if they were armed, they would be seen as a legitimate target is clearly without merit as they -are- seen as a target, armed or not.
  
  
• |-|05|

  1 Oct 06, 12:32

  Originally posted by scabstermooch:

  So what is the point of having an escort then? Plus, he was there for 40 mins. They need to regroup and have a snatch squad or something to go for the truck drivers.
  
  Imo, it is criminal that Halliburton refused to up-armor the trucks, and allow their drivers to carry arms. The argument that if they were armed, they would be seen as a legitimate target is clearly without merit as they -are- seen as a target, armed or not.
  
  

  Having and escort is mainly to prevent an attack.40mins is not actually that long a time to move out regrp and fight back.
  But i do agree they need to arm the drivers i mean if EVERY iraqi family can own a rifle i dont see why truck drivers cant!!
• zenden9

  1 Oct 06, 12:55

  Absolutely no excuse for such behaviour of a soldier! I saw someone here defending them,Is it becos they are American soldier?
  
  If it is some Africa soldier or South American soldier,I think u all will not hesitate to hurl abuse at them.
  
  Whether we are at the actual scene or behind the computer. Such act from soldier is COWARD and as some say,ought to be shot! Which i fully agree... Espcially it was the soldier mistake to lead them wrongly in the first place.
  
  
• Hellraiza

  1 Oct 06, 23:30

  Originally posted by zenden9:

  Absolutely no excuse for such behaviour of a soldier! I saw someone here defending them,Is it becos they are American soldier?
  
  If it is some Africa soldier or South American soldier,I think u all will not hesitate to hurl abuse at them.
  
  Whether we are at the actual scene or behind the computer. Such act from soldier is COWARD and as some say,ought to be shot! Which i fully agree... Espcially it was the soldier mistake to lead them wrongly in the first place.
  
  

  would you rather have died.
• SlowPoke

  1 Oct 06, 23:48

  and thus begins the war of words between the armchair generals.....
• Hellraiza

  1 Oct 06, 23:53

  Originally posted by SlowPoke:

  and thus begins the war of words between the armchair generals.....

  who? I certainly hope it's not me. I'm just your regular rifleman.
• Shotgun

  2 Oct 06, 00:32

  Don't stop...? but those guys are civilian truck drivers... if ur armed escort drives off immediately when someone starts shooting, then wads the point of having armed escorts in the first bloody place? Scare the kids so they stop throwing rocks?
  
  Military convoy where every vehicle has armed personnel, yes, don't bloody stop. But this is not the case. The civilian truck drivers are unarmed, and taking fire.
• scabstermooch

  2 Oct 06, 02:03

  Precisely. If you are going to do your normal ambush drills, then you are not doing much escorting and the trucks will be nothing more than bait. IE the inclusion of supply trucks clearly makes the convoy a more attractive target relative to a normal armoured/vehicle/foot patrol. With that in mind, to bugger off at the first sign of trouble is just...not on.
  
  
• moca

  2 Oct 06, 07:12

  As I remember, there's 2 response to an ambush:
  
  * Get out, or...
  
  * Fight your way out.
  
  In the heat of battle, it is sometimes easy to confuse the 2.
  
  As the armed escort was driving off, the truck behind it was still mobile. It was only after a while that the trucks start to get disabled.
  
  So if you are the escort vehicle, what would you have done? In hindsight, the thing to do was to turn back and pick up the drivers of the disabled trucks.
  
  In hindsight everything is clear.
  
  Everyone makes mistakes especially in the confusion of battle.
  
  As commander of your vehicle, you are responsible to the lives of the troops under you first, the truck drivers second. If you go back, you could get everyone killed and achieve nothing. Hard decision.
  
  Arming the truck drivers is out of the questions. First of all, they are not trained.
  
  Also, I think the author of the film survived because he wasn't firing a weapon and the insurgents kinda forgot about him.