Lesson for Israel
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Underestimate them?Originally posted by dotaro:Hezbollah hide in behind civilians.
How to fight them?!
Do not underestimate Israel.
If not for the despicable militant group using civilians as shields, They would have already been wiped out!
Human shield or not.. Their commanders failed to enticipate the strategy and tactics of the hezbollah... doesn't it say something about the military leaders of the Israel?
Quoted from "SUN TZU ON THE ART OF WAR"
If you know the enemy
and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a
hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy,
for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat.
If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will
succumb in every battle
The Hezbollah is stronger and more organised than they were 6 years ago... If the Israel cannot not wipe them out before their withdrawal from Lebanon in 2000, what makes you think they can succeed now? -
I don't think the Lebanese had much of choice in that matter. Besides, their government was weak and unable to even provide basic services and amenities such as education and health care, which Hezbollah were able to provide. So even if the Lebanese disapproved of Hezbollah's militant policies, they had no means of ejecting them.Originally posted by audiovideo:don't cry for lebanon.
If the people of this country allows Hezbollah to make use of their land and resources to harrass the innocent people of Israel, don't blame Israel.
Do you allow your neighbour to keep disturbing your family members? throwing stone at them or setting fire at your front door and etc? Will you beat the hell out of them?
You will! with all your might. -
The government in Lebanon is weak, and has allowed Hezbollah to do a better job than them. Hezbollah has already won the wills of the people by providing education, healthcare, public services. If the Israelis continue to destroy Lebanese infrastructure, it's to Hezbollah's benefit. The radicals will just rebuild them, and gain credit!
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Underestimate them?
Prob it's true IDF underestimated them. I dun think theworld anticipated Hezbollah having guided missles that can hit at their cruiser.
Human shield or not.. Their commanders failed to enticipate the strategy and tactics of the hezbollah... doesn't it say something about the military leaders of the Israel?
Quoted from "SUN TZU ON THE ART OF WAR"
If you know the enemy
and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a
hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy,
for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat.
If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will
succumb in every battle
The Hezbollah is stronger and more organised than they were 6 years ago... If the Israel cannot not wipe them out before their withdrawal from Lebanon in 2000, what makes you think they can succeed now?
How on earth did Hezbollah obtain their missles and rockets?
As we're reading this now, Iran is smuggling all the weapons to Hezbollah.
Can you imagine Jeremiah Islamiah having guided detonators?
Some things, nobody can "know the enemy" one....
Israel wanted to pressure Lebenon in forcing Hezbollah to drop arms initially, that is why only the reserve division is recalled. But nobody expected Hezbollah to withstand and the Lebanese garmen to sit back....
Anyway, the world is waiting if IDF will launch the counter offensive, having mobilising 3 divisions.
Just take a look at how Israel countered in the six-day back then.... -
just a small note...its jemaah, not jeremiah.
cheers -
GOSh !!!Originally posted by tripwire:alternatively... you could sent all their civilians packing and push them out of the occupied zone, then create a new border complete with minefields and concrete wall.
Is everyone ok with this statement ??
So you invaded a part of a country, forced their citizen to the north, place landmine and concrete wall..
they then again resist by firing rockets into their occupied land. You then start another offensive for self defence, then invade again and forced their citizen out of their entire country... a total conquest then placed settlements and take over their homes and declared that this is compensation.... What a plan indeed.
Wait a minute - Am I describing the current situation ?? -
Video Israel Doesn't Want You to See
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tW1-_JmXQt0&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Ftvnewslies%2Eorg%2Fhtml%2Fthe%5Fisrael%5Fyou%5Fdon%5Ft%5Fsee%5Fon%5Fth%2Ehtml -
Originally posted by MobyDog:
the final sentence is "its a mistake"
[b]Video Israel Doesn't Want You to See
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tW1-_JmXQt0&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Ftvnewslies%2Eorg%2Fhtml%2Fthe%5Fisrael%5Fyou%5Fdon%5Ft%5Fsee%5Fon%5Fth%2Ehtml
[/b]
the israeli superior has openly acknowledged it. i think its far better than some forces that don't even want to comment on their faults and wrongdoings.
in the first place why was the woman behind the door? it wasn't said much of that. -
Originally posted by tiggersgd
Err...tigger...the woman is standing behind the door maybe just to check on the IDF soldiers knocking on her door...after all there is no reason why she can't be standing behind it as its part of her house....
in the first place why was the woman behind the door? it wasn't said much of that. -
Try fighting an enemy who is probably firing rockets from rooftops of primary schools..
Israeli Commanders must have known all these tactics and made their 'moral' decisions way before the strikes ever started.
I doubt they underestimated the enemy, more likely they see its growing capabilities and is now ready to dealt them a heavy blow. I only hope they can truly finish the job.
Just tinking, US seem to be just waiting for countries like Syria to join in and give them a reason to come to Israels aid... -
Originally posted by tiggersgd:
Yes, but according to BBC this video was smuggled out. Soldiers sometimes have no choice but to do what they are oreded.
the final sentence is "its a mistake"
the israeli superior has openly acknowledged it. i think its far better than some forces that don't even want to comment on their faults and wrongdoings.
Have the perpetrator been persecuted for shooting the unarmed woman ?in the first place why was the woman behind the door? it wasn't said much of that.
Curiously, tiggersgd, How do you normally open your door ?? -
opened the door only to have a bomb exploding in ur face?Originally posted by MobyDog:Curiously, tiggersgd, How do you normally open your door ??
would u open that door urself? try it when u reach ur house's main door (if there's a bomb in the first place)? -
don't get me wrong n understand this: in any situation in the middle-east, it is forbidden for women to speak to men much less to even observe anything in times of a skirmish/war etc.Originally posted by tankee1981:Err...tigger...the woman is standing behind the door maybe just to check on the IDF soldiers knocking on her door...after all there is no reason why she can't be standing behind it as its part of her house....
this vid is a one sided and mostly u can see it may have been censored to a certain extent. i'm not buying the whole lot of the vids. media as it is, is still "media" that may unethically censored off certain parts of the vid just to get at certain countries. maybe we should ask, y dun they film the other side of the grp?
how much can it be to knock down a wall? -
show me the other side of the vids that killed israelis by "legalised n civilised" means. proof that they're clean and are the ones being persecuted by the israelis.
mobydog, show me the vids.
i'll be waiting. -
WTF, are you talking about ?? Are you on Grass ???Originally posted by tiggersgd:opened the door only to have a bomb exploding in ur face?
would u open that door urself? try it when u reach ur house's main door (if there's a bomb in the first place)?
By your very post, you mean the IDF asked that women to open her door, so that there won't be any Booby traps ? If that's the case why shoot her then ??show me the other side of the vids that killed israelis by "legalised n civilised" means. proof that they're clean and are the ones being persecuted by the israelis.
What the fvck are talking about ?
mobydog, show me the vids. i'll be waiting.
You mean the IDF have every right to shoot unarmed civilians ?? Since when ?
On the 'Legalised n civilised means'-
Don't people of occupied lands have the right of resistance... If you don't want resistance.. get the fvck out of other peoples lands.. than forced them out and take over their lands and homes. You know that I am stating the truth.proof that they're clean and are the ones being persecuted by the israelis.
If they are't clean, the IDF would have tied and beaten up the Father, then arrest him, put him in prison with the other 9,000, without trial already. That's the Israel MO .. right ?mobydog, show me the vids. i'll be waiting
Again, what the fvck are you rumbling about.
If you are the one challenging my points and inventing another yourself, then shouldn't you be the one who should show me your vids.. I'm suppose to be the one waiting ...
I'm still waiting.... -
From my point of view.. the Israeli has seriously underestimated the Hezbollah.Originally posted by saberlancer:Try fighting an enemy who is probably firing rockets from rooftops of primary schools..
Israeli Commanders must have known all these tactics and made their 'moral' decisions way before the strikes ever started.
I doubt they underestimated the enemy, more likely they see its growing capabilities and is now ready to dealt them a heavy blow. I only hope they can truly finish the job.
Look at the damages in the city of Haifa.. were the Israeli prepared? Hell no..
I've read that the IDF had conducted thousands of air raids against the Hezbollah and till yesterday I still read reports on rockets being fired into northen Israel.
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3279888,00.html
IMHO chances of Israel accomplishing their objective is getting slimmer and slimmer as the days go by. -
ur language sux. if u cant show me the other position's vids then what kind of balance is that media's opinion based on? i would say its bias and may even suggest that it has been doctored.Originally posted by MobyDog:Again, what the fvck are you rumbling about.
If you are the one challenging my points and inventing another yourself, then shouldn't you be the one who should show me your vids.. I'm suppose to be the one waiting ...
I'm still waiting....
u r the one that showed proof thru the vid (israelis injuring innocent) above izzit? then all i'm asking is u show the other side of the vids...the vids where innocent israelis are being bombed and killed in even more vicious ways. u dun have any?? y am i not surprised.
n y r u so pissed? are u on grass as well?
i think so...wahahahahahaha. if i even want to invent anything, it will be a clone for myself.
n pls dun go around showing one sided stories. u are a sad case of uncivilised (in terms of ur language) n of ignorance and arrogance.
wait? sure, let's all wait n see. duh?!!! -
Originally posted by tiggersgd:
What are you - communist ? Does Israel news reports things the way you suggested.. of course not. If so, you rhetorics is just a cheap shot.
ur language sux. if u cant show me the other position's vids then what kind of balance is that media's opinion based on? i would say its bias and may even suggest that it has been doctored.
Doctored ??? I can simply use this word on almost all news, videos and photos to counter any arguments and comments. It's simply unreasonable on your part.u r the one that showed proof thru the vid (israelis injuring innocent) above izzit? then all i'm asking is u show the other side of the vids...the vids where innocent israelis are being bombed and killed in even more vicious ways. u dun have any?? y am i not surprised.
What logic would that be ? Why should I contradict myself ??
The Israeli's have always claimed the moral high grounds in most of their actions and waste no time in airing any Israeli's death..
With little efforts you can find them yourself all over the net... and that's thing I'm talking about. I'm giving another side of the things... and in effect, that's makes me bias.n y r u so pissed? are u on grass as well?
Talking about arrogance... and ignorance. i think so...wahahahahahaha. if i even want to invent anything, it will be a clone for myself.
n pls dun go around showing one sided stories. u are a sad case of uncivilised (in terms of ur language) n of ignorance and arrogance.
wait? sure, let's all wait n see. duh?!!!
It is a video of a single event, or if you could provide other videos of Palestinian Soldiers doing house searches, shoots a women, destroy the interior and break down their walls, while occupying Israel lands?? I admit I know no vid of such kind.. because Israel is not occupied.
If you have in possession of such a vid, Then I would say that 'that vid bias.
Do you have any vid there mirrors that vid scenario..?? -
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IDF setback at Bint Jbeil
By Ed Blanche JDW Special Correspondent
Beirut,01 August 2006
An elite unit of the Israel Defence Force (IDF) suffered a major setback in its thrust into south Lebanon on 26 July when it was confronted by fighters from the Islamic Resistance - the armed wing of the Lebanese Shi'ite Party of God (Hizbullah) - in the strategic hilltop village of Bint Jbeil.
In fierce close-quarter fighting, often hand-to-hand, two infantry companies of the IDF Golani Brigade's 51st Battalion were apparently ambushed in the village's narrow streets.
The IDF suffered eight dead - including the battalion's deputy commander, Major Roi Klein, who threw himself on a grenade - and 25 wounded; they were forced to withdraw in some of the heaviest combat since the fighting began on 12 July.
119 of 338 words
© 2006 Jane's Information Group -
im not going to comment about who's right or wrong in the conflict, i think its too grey and lines are too blurred.
but reading the artical above, if it did actually happen. i salute the major who gave his life to save his men from the grenade.
wonder if i would see that if the saf is called to battle
RIP -
I believe more than a decade ago, during a live grenade training. An SAF officer actually did exactly that when one of the Trainee dropped a primed grenade behind the sandbox.Originally posted by Nuad:im not going to comment about who's right or wrong in the conflict, i think its too grey and lines are too blurred.
but reading the artical above, if it did actually happen. i salute the major who gave his life to save his men from the grenade.
wonder if i would see that if the saf is called to battle
RIP
From what I know.. he threw himself over the grenade to lessen the impact.
If I remember correctly.. any old old bird here to clarify. -
From what I heard he didn't throw himself on the grenade leh, he pushed the recruit out of harms way but lacked the time to take cover.
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By BENJAMIN HARVEY, Associated Press Writer
2 hours, 18 minutes ago
JERUSALEM - Hezbollah's sophisticated anti-tank missiles are perhaps the guerrilla group's deadliest weapon in Lebanon fighting, with their ability to pierce Israel's most advanced tanks.
Experts say this is further evidence that Israel is facing a well-equipped army in this war, not a ragtag militia.
Hezbollah has fired Russian-made Metis-M anti-tank missiles and owns European-made Milan missiles, the army confirmed on Friday.
In the last two days alone, these missiles have killed seven soldiers and damaged three Israeli-made Merkava tanks — mountains of steel that are vaunted as symbols of Israel's military might, the army said. Israeli media say most of the 44 soldiers killed in four weeks of fighting were hit by anti-tank missiles.
"They (Hezbollah guerrillas) have some of the most advanced anti-tank missiles in the world," said Yossi Kuperwasser, a senior military intelligence officer who retired earlier this summer.
"This is not a militia, it's an infantry brigade with all the support units," Kuperwasser said
Looks like merkava are not so advance after all ... SAF should learn a lesson from IDF performance in this conflict... I just hope SAF dun be so complacent ... If merkava is can destroy so easily how about our AMX 13 10 p ... easy meat! -
Pls lah, only fools (or those who don't do their homework) assume the worlds best MBTS like the Abrams or the Merkava are unhurtable. Given the right amount of explosives any tank will be vulnerable. What tanks do against what is more of an effect of people who think war is only waged by getting the best weapons and charging in on a technologically weaker foe. Which is hardly the case.
What is wrong here is not the tanks (which are doing as well as they can given what they are taking), it is really the tatics that need to be worked on bringing the best abilities of the Merk against their foes and working to cover up their weakness. But I don't think they have any much better tank in the world to go into battle with.
I think people focus too much on the losses at times, one never bothered to count how many lives were saved by the tanks. While one may here reports of an Abrams or two being demolished by massive IEDs in Iraq, the truth is (and if you have seen the pictures), the tanks have held out very well in most cases to being attacked by IEDs that would have killed soldiers had they been in lesser machines.