LCA (Light Combat Aircraft) Tejas
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hi rambo, no offence taken, but you may wish to consider your comments in its context. e.g. u comparing sheer absolute capabilities or relativity?Originally posted by RAMBO29:All I know IAF is better than RSAF and PAF.No Offence
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u are doing more than talking or discussing abt things relating to the state of India. if you dun see it, others do.Originally posted by arjun:Let me remind you people that one will not become a nationalist if he talks or discusses things related to ones nation. And I am just doing that.
I think you are discussing about this article:
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/896301.cms
Why are you so bothered about this article on American F-16's losing.
Why should you be bothered about this article. Singapore faces challenges and it is unique to Singapore and the weapon system the Singapore Armed forces possess is enough to counter those challenges. So why worry?
Here is some info on SINDEX:
http://www.mindef.gov.sg/imindef/news_and_events/nr/2004/oct/26oct04_nr.html
http://www.mindef.gov.sg/imindef/news_and_events/nr/2006/jan/03jan06_nr.html
er, i was never bothered by the article. your fellow countrymen were. both sides knew the truth behind the falsehoods in the article. mebbe u can explain why the writer was so concerned abt F16s that made him write the article in the 1st place? i'm well aware of my country's challenges and how we deal with them. thanks for asking, but i dun worry excessively or unnecessarily cos there are other fishes to fry too.
thnaks for the links, but you have not answered the qns.
how the LCA is "made to be better than those planes" e.g. F16, F15, Mig 29, Mirage2k5 etc. i suppose u going put the LCA on par with the Euro canards?
how do you rate your air force's performance against RSAF during SINDEX 04?
what was the kill ratio?
ta! -
how do you rate your air force's performance against RSAF during SINDEX 04?
Without any information provided by the RSAF and IAF how can one rate the performance of the IAF or RSAF?
what was the kill ratio?
Check the above links leading to the government site but no info on who performed better. -
Some new information on the Kaveri engine and the LCA project
http://www.india-defence.com/reports/1466
Asian Aerospace 2006: Kaveri K9 on track for testing
New Delhi: India's Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) plans to deliver a Kaveri K9 turbofan to Russia for flight tests by mid-year in the run-up to the engine's installation in the Tejas light combat aircraft (LCA) by the end of 2006.
The long-awaited Kaveri test move comes as Snecma wins an ADA contract to assist in its final development phase. "It's more of a peer review contract," says ADA propulsion systems group director Swaminathan Ratnam, who adds the upcoming Russian tests are scheduled to run from June through September on an Ilyushin Il-76 testbed.
Following the completion of tests, the engine will be returned to Bangalore for the start of installation work on PV1 (prototype vehicle), one of four LCAs currently engaged in flight tests. The indigenously developed Kaveri, originally planned as the baseline engine for the LCA, will replace the General Electric F404-IN20, 11 of which have now been supplied to the indigenous Indian fighter programme. The integration effort will involve replacing sections of the fuselage as well as an inlet design optimised for the Kaveri. Flight tests are not expected to start until well into 2007. Meanwhile, the ADA displayed at Asian Aerospace a model of the naval version of LCA -
how the LCA is "made to be better than those planes" e.g. F16, F15, Mig 29, Mirage2k5 etc. i suppose u going put the LCA on par with the Euro canards?
http://www.cs.usyd.edu.au/~jdavis/wshop/kota.doc.
From the above article by K.H
Fig. 1. LCA in Flight
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* High survivability in ECM/ECCM environment
Adequate range for close support and interdiction
The need was that performance must be superior to fighters such as F-16 of American origin, Mirage-2000 of French origin and Mig-29 of Russian origin. Another requirement was that the technology deployed should enable aircraft remain current for duration of its service without major upgrades. It was evident that goals of performance and life could be achieved only if the best of technologies available in the field of aviation were harnessed in the making of LCA (Fig.2)
Pleas read the article in full. -
yes, my good indian fren, i have read the article in full and nowhere does it state that the LCA is ACTUALLY superior to the F16/Mirage2k5 or the Mig29.Originally posted by arjun:http://www.cs.usyd.edu.au/~jdavis/wshop/kota.doc.
From the above article by K.H
Fig. 1. LCA in Flight
*
* High survivability in ECM/ECCM environment
Adequate range for close support and interdiction
The need was that performance must be superior to fighters such as F-16 of American origin, Mirage-2000 of French origin and Mig-29 of Russian origin. Another requirement was that the technology deployed should enable aircraft remain current for duration of its service without major upgrades. It was evident that goals of performance and life could be achieved only if the best of technologies available in the field of aviation were harnessed in the making of LCA (Fig.2)
Pleas read the article in full.
Let me guide you thru your quoted extract: the latter states that the performance of the a/c MUST be superior; not that it actually is. Another REQUIREMENT is that the technology has to remain current. However, it is evident that these 2 requirements CAN only be achieved IF the best of aviation technologies WERE harnessed in the making of the LCA. Going by the probs faced by the manufacturers, i sure pple can draw their own conclusions.
Please read the article CAREFULLY and in full
it seems to me that while you are loyal to your home brand, you have done so at others' expense. and for all the patriotic qualities that you display and all the info you have quoted, you seem unable to understand the nuances of the article.
your response pls.
PS: i'm very tempted to say that you're not the sharpest knife in the kitchen, but that would be too personal and childish... so i shall hold back that comment.
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the info was not provided becos both sides respect and are grateful for the mutually beneficial opportunity. besides those who really know the outcome are well aware of the results. obviously, you are not privy to them. never mind then... i'll concede this point in lieu of your percieved ignorance. cheers!Originally posted by arjun:Without any information provided by the RSAF and IAF how can one rate the performance of the IAF or RSAF?
Check the above links leading to the government site but no info on who performed better.
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I do respect SAF..
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the latter states that the performance of the a/c MUST be superior; not that it actually is.
If one talks about making the aircraft to be superior means he has the intention to do so and he is talking all after the successful flight of the LCA, we can assume that the LCA is superior.Another REQUIREMENT is that the technology has to remain current. However, it is evident that these 2 requirements CAN only be achieved IF the best of aviation technologies WERE harnessed in the making of the LCA.
By going through the article, you will come across this part and then you see KH explaining the advanced state of the art technologies used in the development of the LCA and Core Technologies and Design Concepts of LCA.
http://72.14.207.104/search?q=cache:6g6pk-kqmh8J:www.cs.usyd.edu.au/~jdavis/wshop/kota.doc+lca%2Bmirage%2Bkota%2Bf-16%2Bmig&hl=en&gl=in&ct=clnk&cd=6
http://www.cs.usyd.edu.au/~jdavis/wshop/kota.docGoing by the probs faced by the manufacturers, i sure pple can draw their own conclusions.
The conclusion is that LCA programme became so tough because of the reasons stated above.
To really know the superiority of LCA, it need to be inducted into the IAF and the IAF must conduct exercise with the LCA and the MIg-29's and Mirages. -
Tejas prototype makes supersonic flight
BANGALORE, MAY 13 (PTI)
http://www.outlookindia.com/pti_news.asp?id=384565
A prototype of India's indigenous Tejas light combat aircraft made a supersonic flight here today.
The PV 2 prototype is the "definitve" operational version of the Tejas jet for induction into the Indian Air Force (IAF). It first made a supersonic flight yesterday, the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) here said.
It made another supersonic flight today, for the first time carrying two state-of-the-art air-to-air missiles. This indicated the jet's entry into the operational flight test phase, it said.
The test flight was flown by Wing Commander Vikram Singh and lasted 24 minutes, the ADA said.
The Tejas is meant to replace the IAF's ageing fleet of Russian-made MiG jets. -
ok...after all th etesting....has it INDUCTED ont the force? Has the IN consider the LCA-N also after considering MiG-29K?
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oh and btw thanks for being a salesman here......
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well, it looks like i have to concede and admit i'm wrong here... i'm wrong to thnk that Arjun has any sense at all...
ok, hotshot, u wanna carry on living in your la-la land and "assume" that the LCA is superior, go ahead. i'll let facts prove themselves true (hopefully in peaceful circumstances rather than in any war). Using your warped sense of logic, if LMTAS, boeing, Mig and dassault all tok abt making their respective a/c superior to the LCA, that means they have the intention to do so and waht's more, unlike the Indians, they all have the capability to do so. therefore, we can assume that their ftrs are superior.
"To really know the superiority of LCA, it need to be inducted into the IAF and the IAF must conduct exercise with the LCA and the MIg-29's and Mirages."
You could not have said it better... yes, before you continue trumpeting the LCA, let the IAF "induct" the LCA first, then conduct an Ex with Mig29 and Mirage2K5, and finally let the factual results speak for themselves.
since we cant see eye to eye on this, let's agree to disagree and move on... it seems senseless to continue debating this when you fail to see the logic... -
ok...after all th etesting....has it INDUCTED ont the force? Has the IN consider the LCA-N also after considering MiG-29K?
The navy has shown keen interest in the NLCA and one of the pilots flying the LCA is a naval pilot. The Mig-29K's are in limited numbers and is for the INS Vikramaditya or the AC acquired from Russia. The Indian AC will have the NLCA.
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NAVY/LCA.html
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Originally posted by arjun:
How it is going to be indigenous engine with a foreign company providing assist in the final design? They shall not use the word 'indigenous'
Some new information on the Kaveri engine and the LCA project
http://www.india-defence.com/reports/1466
Asian Aerospace 2006: Kaveri K9 on track for testing
New Delhi: India's Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) plans to deliver a Kaveri K9 turbofan to Russia for flight tests by mid-year in the run-up to the engine's installation in the Tejas light combat aircraft (LCA) by the end of 2006.
The long-awaited Kaveri test move comes as Snecma wins an ADA contract to assist in its final development phase. "It's more of a peer review contract," says ADA propulsion systems group director Swaminathan Ratnam, who adds the upcoming Russian tests are scheduled to run from June through September on an Ilyushin Il-76 testbed.
Following the completion of tests, the engine will be returned to Bangalore for the start of installation work on PV1 (prototype vehicle), one of four LCAs currently engaged in flight tests. The indigenously developed Kaveri, originally planned as the baseline engine for the LCA, will replace the General Electric F404-IN20, 11 of which have now been supplied to the indigenous Indian fighter programme. The integration effort will involve replacing sections of the fuselage as well as an inlet design optimised for the Kaveri. Flight tests are not expected to start until well into 2007. Meanwhile, the ADA displayed at Asian Aerospace a model of the naval version of LCA Most probably at the end of the day. The indians don't even know how 40% of the engine works and cannot produce 100% of all the parts! -
Ok loh,u say superior means superiror loh! In yr mind,I think one LCA can take on three F-22/A one LOL!!!Originally posted by arjun:If one talks about making the aircraft to be superior means he has the intention to do so and he is talking all after the successful flight of the LCA, we can assume that the LCA is superior. Wow?? Don't know why military nuts recently go so many Bollywood Beng,so phakia one... Die,die say their things is good.... -
They shall not use the word 'indigenous'
If you call a mechanic to repair your vehicle, will it means that the vehicle belongs to the mechanic?
The Kaveri is 100% ready. The only problem is that there is a problem with it working. How you are going to solve it? With certain changes here and there. And why is India not able to do it? Because we had never made an engine before. Why is the French company consulted by paying them money. Because once this problem is solved, India need not have to go for foreign engines for LCA or MCA. Better say self reliant in military aviationI think one LCA can take on three F-22/A one LOL!!!
Interesting. Why three F-22 why not 12 F-22's.
Anyway you have to wait for the MCA to come and then we can talk about beating three F-22's -
Oh...I see,so snecma just come in and repair? Did u see the word 'assist in the design'? Repair is a total different word? What does it go to do with repair? If the mechanic assists in Toyota in the making the new engine,Totoya got to pay him money and copyright fee,u know? Toyota cannot anyhow modify and sell the engine without the mechanic permission... I think Snecma is no stupid too! Let u know how and obtain the tech and break independents on them? Then they no need make money liao? They will make sure something u nvr know which u can only invent and understand by yrselfOriginally posted by arjun:quote:
If you call a mechanic to repair your vehicle, will it means that the vehicle belongs to the mechanic?
The Kaveri is 100% ready. The only problem is that there is a problem with it working. How you are going to solve it? With certain changes here and there. And why is India not able to do it? Because we had never made an engine before. Why is the French company consulted by paying them money. Because once this problem is solved, India need not have to go for foreign engines for LCA or MCA. Better say self reliant in military aviation
Wah? typical Bolly beng.. I give u 3 F-22 gd enough to save yr face liao. U want 12? Terrible!Originally posted by arjun:quote:
Interesting. Why three F-22 why not 12 F-22's.
Anyway you have to wait for the MCA to come and then we can talk about beating three F-22's
Interesting. Why three F-22 why not 12 F-22's.
Anyway you have to wait for the MCA to come and then we can talk about beating three F-22's In yr wet dream,maybe it will happen! -
Yes, they Snecma is repairing the engine. After the repair it will be sent for the tests.
Oh...I see,so snecma just come in and repair? Did u see the word 'assist in the design'? Repair is a total different word? What does it go to do with repair? If the mechanic assists in Toyota in the making the new engine,Totoya got to pay him money and copyright fee,u know? Toyota cannot anyhow modify and sell the engine without the mechanic permission... I think Snecma is no stupid too! Let u know how and obtain the tech and break independents on them? Then they no need make money liao? They will make sure something u nvr know which u can only invent and understand by yrself
They will not make money if they did not work with the project. Else it will be done by someone else. This is a colloboration in which the French company will benifit as well as India and they are getting good money in doing so. They cannot claim the copyright since the product is already developed and they are consulted to solve the problem. Once the problem is found and fixed with cetain alterations in the engine, it will be tested.
No wet dreams and no day dreaming but the morning dream that will always come true. -
arjun, pls give it a break lar... you're really spoiling the whole discussion. if u want to debate, that's fine... but if you consistently fail to see the points everyone here is trying to make, then there's no point discussing anymore rite? see how this has progressed?
guys, no point forcing this bull to drink water.... let time and facts speak for themselves... hmmmm... let's jus stopping posting here and let the thread die a natural death.
cheers you all! -
got gooddness sake is just a paper plane.....there is not a prototype yet!!!!Originally posted by arjun:The navy has shown keen interest in the NLCA and one of the pilots flying the LCA is a naval pilot. The Mig-29K's are in limited numbers and is for the INS Vikramaditya or the AC acquired from Russia. The Indian AC will have the NLCA.
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/NAVY/LCA.html -
that's why this forum is called military nuts.
if it was more serious it would have been called Pointer or something...Originally posted by qnh1011:arjun, pls give it a break lar... you're really spoiling the whole discussion. if u want to debate, that's fine... but if you consistently fail to see the points everyone here is trying to make, then there's no point discussing anymore rite? see how this has progressed?
guys, no point forcing this bull to drink water.... let time and facts speak for themselves... hmmmm... let's jus stopping posting here and let the thread die a natural death.
cheers you all! -
got gooddness sake is just a paper plane.....there is not a prototype yet!!!!
You lack such basic knowledge even after spoon feeding. You must have checked the previous posts before posting such crap. I had posted a lot of information on the Tejas and you still don't know anything about the LCA. There is a story about a person (A) telling the story of Ramayana to another person (B) and in the end he (B) asks who is Rama (The main character). You look similar to him.
Please read this:
Tejas prototype makes supersonic flight
BANGALORE, MAY 13 (PTI)
http://www.outlookindia.com/pti_news.asp?id=384565
More news for you:
http://www.newindpress.com/Newsitems.asp?ID=IE120060514131438&Title=Bangalore&Topic=0
HAL to go into supersonic mode
Monday May 15 2006 00:00 IST
BANGALORE: Five years after the first indigenous developmental fighter took to the air after complaints of time and technology gaps, the defence PSU - Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) - has now decided to go into supersonic mode.
HAL chairman Ashok Baweja told this website's newspaper that the fifth prototype vehicle, trainer and the first of the eight Limited Series Production (LSP) will join the programme this year. These aircraft will help accelerate the initial operational clearance for the LCA.
On Saturday, PV2, among a cluster of four jets built, turned supersonic with air-to-air missiles on board. Scientists of the Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA) said it was a big leap forward in the project as the jet was now propelled into operational test light mode.
‘‘As for the LCA project, it is a war-room like situation at HAL. I am getting daily inputs from officers on the progress made in the project,’’ the HAL chief said.
HAL has now taken up the challenge to complete the eight LSPs and 20 more aircraft within three years. The IAF will induct these delta-winged worldÂ’s lightest fighter aircraft by 2010 to replace its ageing fleet of MiGs.
The PSUÂ’s focus now is on stepping up the pressure on this strategically important project to ensure that there are no further delays. Three more aircraft, which will join the test flying envelope later this year, will increase the number of aircraft used for certification.
In all, four LCAs, two technology demonstrators and two prototypes had logged over 525 flights.
Not just HAL, but even the ADA has accelerated the programme to the next level by putting a radar on the aircraft and is taking up a weaponisation programme by fitting pylons on the PV2.
The PV2 is a much lighter aircraft and possesses advanced software technology, unlike the Test Demonstrator I, II and PV1. There is a quantum jump in the build standard of PV2, which is a software intensive fourth generation combat aircraft built to production standard. Besides having a high percentage of composite materials in its airframe structure, it incorporates a state-of-the-art, integrated, modular avionics system with open architecture concepts to facilitate easy hardware and software upgrades and re-usability.
The avionics system of Tejas PV II provides excellent pilot vehicle interface in a glass cockpit which has an all-round panoramic view to reduce the pilotÂ’s workload and to increase situational awareness. -
What he means is the Naval Version is still a paper plane! It has not materialise yet,not even prototype is seen! What u quote and give is only the land version!Originally posted by arjun:You lack such basic knowledge even after spoon feeding. You must have checked the previous posts before posting such crap. I had posted a lot of information on the Tejas and you still don't know anything about the LCA. There is a story about a person (A) telling the story of Ramayana to another person (B) and in the end he (B) asks who is Rama (The main character). You look similar to him. -
x2...this is WHAT I MEANTOriginally posted by zenden9:What he means is the Naval Version is still a paper plane! It has not materialise yet,not even prototype is seen! What u quote and give is only the land version!