Sg buy 300 Terrex AV81 IFV?
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hoorah! hoorah! hoorah!
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1.Sg have lost again in IFV,as expected.
Belgium Selects Pirahna IIIs for $850M APC Contract,
Controversies Ensue Posted 10-Feb-2006
2.Belgium also use IFV to replace MBT.In DID's July 2005 article covering Belgium's impending defense purchases,we noted that country's Armoured Infantry Vehicle (AIV) program to replace its 132 Leopard 1A5BE main battle tanks, as well as its AIFV and M113 armored personnel carriers, with wheeled APCs.
3.Everything can go disappear!!
[b]On February 3, 2006, it was reported that 15 of Belgium's Pandur armored personnel carriers were stolen, together with radio equipment and field kitchens. The equipment was meant for a Beninese battalion that is part of the UN force in the Congo. -
last heard when i was still serving was that the terrex will go to the infantry...
about time the infantry gets to "ride" into the battlefield instead of walking....
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Isn't it a little silly to replace MBTs with IFVs?
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I'm pretty sure they thought of all that before they actually built it.Originally posted by fudgester:Truth be told, I don't like wheeled vehicles. They may be suited for stealth FIBUA ops as they are generally quieter. However, the wheels are more vulnerable to small-arms fire. They also sink in mud more easily and are more likely to set off anti-tank mines (both due to higher ground pressure).
Also, our M113 Ultras, Bionixs, and Broncos are all amphibious with some minor preparations. They can all swim using their tracks. Does anyine know whether the Terrex has propellors or waterjets to make it amphibious?
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Stealth? They're quieter than tanks for sure especially on metal roads but the engine is pretty dam loud - nothing stealthy about it I can assure you.Originally posted by fudgester:Truth be told, I don't like wheeled vehicles. They may be suited for stealth FIBUA ops as they are generally quieter. -
I think he meant quieter for the people being ferried around by it.Originally posted by tvdog:Stealth? They're quieter than tanks for sure especially on metal roads but the engine is pretty dam loud - nothing stealthy about it I can assure you. -
Those who have heard of the metal-tracked A-vehicles in the training areas should know about this. Metal-tracks will generate this 'cling..cling', screeching noise when turning and scratching into road surface when on the move. Bronco with rubber tracks are very much quieter. This is especially true when the metal tracks are older which are generally a bit rusted. The noise made by the tracks scratching the road can be minimised by having rubber pads on the tracks but they will wear off in time to come.
I am thinking maybe we can have a hybrid engine where the Terrex can run on electricity during assault in urban terrain such as during dawn attack. This way noise will be lowered to the minimum. Something like in diesel electric submarines.
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There was this tank designed to run off the power of lithium battaries for stealth mode, to power a huge tank, the batteries needed to be errrrm huge, so errrrm, you can see where the rest of it is going.Originally posted by tankee1981:Those who have heard of the metal-tracked A-vehicles in the training areas should know about this. Metal-tracks will generate this 'cling..cling', screeching noise when turning and scratching into road surface when on the move. Bronco with rubber tracks are very much quieter. This is especially true when the metal tracks are older which are generally a bit rusted. The noise made by the tracks scratching the road can be minimised by having rubber pads on the tracks but they will wear off in time to come.
I am thinking maybe we can have a hybrid engine where the Terrex can run on electricity during assault in urban terrain such as during dawn attack. This way noise will be lowered to the minimum. Something like in diesel electric submarines. -
The thread was rambling a bit. Not too sure if SAF or Turkey is buuying the Terrex.
If it is the SAF, I see it more as a translation of lessons learnt from experiences that a certain country had in Somalia. -
Details lah...Originally posted by touchstone_2000:The thread was rambling a bit. Not too sure if SAF or Turkey is buuying the Terrex.
If it is the SAF, I see it more as a translation of lessons learnt from experiences that a certain country had in Somalia. -
A hybrid electrical engine? What a brilliant idea!! It would show to the world that SAF is indeed living up to it's vision of becoming a 3G army ..... but er where you going to find a 3 pin power socket point source to "recharge" your vehicle in the middle of jungle terrain in SEA?Originally posted by tankee1981:Those who have heard of the metal-tracked A-vehicles in the training areas should know about this. Metal-tracks will generate this 'cling..cling', screeching noise when turning and scratching into road surface when on the move. Bronco with rubber tracks are very much quieter. This is especially true when the metal tracks are older which are generally a bit rusted. The noise made by the tracks scratching the road can be minimised by having rubber pads on the tracks but they will wear off in time to come.
I am thinking maybe we can have a hybrid engine where the Terrex can run on electricity during assault in urban terrain such as during dawn attack. This way noise will be lowered to the minimum. Something like in diesel electric submarines. 
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Allow me to explain. Diesel electric submarines don't run on electricity all the time and when the batteries ran out the diesel engines will kick in to recharge these batteries when surfaced. These submarines will run on electric power only when underwater where there is no air for the diesel engines. When travelling with electric power, its much more quiet thus minimising detection by passive sonar. In the case of vehicles since supply of air is not an issue the batteries can be charged whenever the diesel engine is running, much like your normal car batteries but with much more stored power.
What i am proposing is that the vehicle can switch to electric power when carrying out the initial phase of a surprise attack to minimise noise but will switch back to diesel power when the element of surprise is lost and when greater speed and power is required during fighting.
The technology for hybrid engine cars is matured and these cars are already out in the market so the prospect of having hybrid engine armoured vehicles may not be that remote a possibility. -
imagine the size of the batteries as well as the problems like recharging etc in combat environment.Originally posted by tankee1981:...the diesel engine is running, much like your normal car batteries but with much more stored power.
What i am proposing is that the vehicle can switch to electric power when carrying out the initial phase of a surprise attack to minimise noise but will switch back to diesel power when the element of surprise is lost and when greater speed and power is required during fighting.
The technology for hybrid engine cars is matured and these cars are already out in the market so the prospect of having hybrid engine armoured vehicles may not be that remote a possibility.
Saw the monster leaving CS facility previous week.
Maybe a good thing to have somthing other than Ultra or Bionix, mix and match. Maybe one system too many?
This would basically be a battle taxi not to replace the IFV or MBT. Any funny ideas about different propolusion systems are obviously ppl not been into the field for more then 3 days. Technology not advanced enough to replace the diesel engines, even petrol engines have a hard time in our terrain. -
Originally posted by baer
imagine the size of the batteries as well as the problems like recharging etc in combat environment.
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Saw the monster leaving CS facility previous week.
Maybe a good thing to have somthing other than Ultra or Bionix, mix and match. Maybe one system too many?
This would basically be a battle taxi not to replace the IFV or MBT. Any funny ideas about different propolusion systems are obviously ppl not been into the field for more then 3 days. Technology not advanced enough to replace the diesel engines, even petrol engines have a hard time in our terrain
Yes, i have been out in the field for more than 3 days.
Don't get me wrong i am not advocating the idea of replacing diesel engines outright. Hybrid engine technology also have the diesel component in it without which the system can't function at all. Recharging of batteries in combat is also not a problem because the batteries will be recharged simultaneously when the diesel engine is running. Diesel engine will be used most of the time, electric power will only kick in when stealth is needed such as when advancing slowly up to the enemy in urban terrain during a surprise dawn attack. At this initial stage,speed and power is not that crucial.
However, i do agree with you that the size of batteries required to move such a big vehicle may be too big to render such an idea feasible. The hybrid engine technology to move an armoured vehicle is simply not matured at the moment, more research and development is thus required.
ps I think we shouldn't dwell too much into this after all this is just a personal proposal by me and not directly related to the topic per se -
tankee, i believe we read the same book once before. hahah.
Basically, its not impossible to create a battery powered version of the terrex that uses its diesel engine to charge power. There are already such vehicles that uses solar power etc to recharge its batteries. On a vehicles like the terrex, u have even more room to house more efficient batteries.
Ideally, in battery mode, it would allow the vehicle to accelerate much faster, since a battery can provide power on demand. No need for gears and transmissions etc. But those would be in place for it to operate in more conventional means lar.
Perhaps a kinda Armored SOF squad can make use of such equipment. The vehicles operating in groups of 4. 1 Command Vehicle, 2 Weapons veh (heavy weaponry, 25mm + atgw or mortar) + 1 Personnel transport veh. We are looking at something very futuristic. Because it can run on battery, it would reduce vehicle heat signatures, and its approach to a target area can be very quiet.
Command vehicle, where the commander and surveillance team would be in would deploy mini-UAVs to recce the strike area. Providing targeting and real time updates to the dismounted SOF squads on the ground. Squads would then use the information from the mini UAVs to conduct their strikes. Remaining 2 weapons vehicles are to provide fire support to the squads. The mortar would be able to fire low-velocity guided munitions on targets designated by the mini-UAVs or the squads on the ground.
Futuristic unconventional warfare. =D -
Is it a confirm information that SAF will buy the terrex IFV ?
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Lost again?
How could they have lost when they were not even considered/shortlisted in the first place?
On a more serous note, the Terrex is still a brand new vechicle and some features are still being developed and tested. Comparing to LAV/Piranha, the orignal design goes way back to almost 25 years ago!!!
A comparison against the newer generation of AFVs would have been more appropriate. And these I mean by the following:
1. French VBCI
2. Finnish Patria AMV
3. GD Panther
4. LAV IV
5. Anglo-German MRAV
Just to name a few.Originally posted by lionnoisy:
1.Sg have lost again in IFV,as expected.
[b]Belgium Selects Pirahna IIIs for $850M APC Contract,
Controversies Ensue Posted 10-Feb-2006
2.Belgium also use IFV to replace MBT.
3.Everything can go disappear!!
On February 3, 2006, it was reported that 15 of Belgium's Pandur armored personnel carriers were stolen, together with radio equipment and field kitchens. The equipment was meant for a Beninese battalion that is part of the UN force in the Congo.
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Finally
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Agree la. No wonder i blur since when our terrex are shortlisted by turkey. nv seen b4 any article to support it.Originally posted by warspite:Lost again?
How could they have lost when they were not even considered/shortlisted in the first place?
On a more serous note, the Terrex is still a brand new vechicle and some features are still being developed and tested. Comparing to LAV/Piranha, the orignal design goes way back to almost 25 years ago!!!
A comparison against the newer generation of AFVs would have been more appropriate. And these I mean by the following:
1. French VBCI
2. Finnish Patria AMV
3. GD Panther
4. LAV IV
5. Anglo-German MRAV
Just to name a few. -
I notice that lionnoisy states that the number is quoted from ADJ. I really doubt the number to be so high. I also read ADJ and the impression they give is their info is sometimes rubbish and bullshit.
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Well i heard sorces say we plan 2 operate 250 of them ,300 is almost there la
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A battery-powered IFV is entirely possible - technically.
During one of my school holiday jobs - ions ago - I worked at a warehouse and they had they eletric-powered jack-lift vehicles. They were real fast and real quiet, and very powerful. Of course they are not as powerful as the diesel ones, but I believe it can be done.
There are already dual power cars - but electric and diesel. So it is another fact that points towards hybrid power IFV being entirely possible.
But, the question is this: How important is this steath factor in a IFV? Is stealth important enough to make sacrifices... eg less armour due to weight and size of a massive and potentially troublesome hybrid engine pack? -
well, from what i see, stealth is really an essential item for the IFV but not worth the sacrifice in terms of amour and survivablitily on the battlefield. As one would probably note, stealth is virtually worth next to nothing in a Gung - Ho dogfight. So yea, it'll be nice if one can strike a balance between Stealth and the other factors itself
Edit: or failing to do so, at least turn the IFV into something that can outshoot whatever the enemy can throw at it -
The technology already exist for sometimeOriginally posted by tvdog:A battery-powered IFV is entirely possible - technically.
pack?
We already have hybrid electric cum petrol car in the market for instance honda civic and toyota prius in Sg that can run entirly on battery power