COPE TAUFAN: USAF F-15s & RMAF MiG-29s IN JOINT AIR EXERCISE
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Source: Air Force Link via Alert5
F-15s, MiGs are allies in the sky
by John Monroe
18th Wing Public Affairs
3/15/2006 - KADENA AIR BASE, Japan (AFPN) -- Multinational pilots from the United States and Malaysia have joined forces in the Pacific skies for Cope Taufan ‘06, a three-week air-to-air training exercise designed to sharpen air combat tactic skills and promote closer relations between allies.
Cope Taufan, Taufan meaning “big storm” in Malaysian, is held bi-annually by the Royal Malaysian Air Force and the U.S. Air Force in Butterworth near the northwest coast of that country.
Eight F-15 Eagles and more than 114 18th Wing maintainers, munition handlers and pilots, are participating in the exercise that began March 10.
The Royal Malaysian Air Force are participating with MiG-29 Fulcrum, Hawk 208 and the F/A-18 Hornet aircraft.
“This exercise is a chance for Team Kadena, regardless of rank or specialty, to work with our counterparts from the Royal Malaysian Air Force to sharpen air combat capabilities and operational proficiencies,” said Lt. Col. Jeff Gustafson, 67th Fighter Squadron commander. “This global engagement is fostering mutually beneficial relations with Malaysia, which facilitates peace and stability in the Pacific region."
The Air Force has often found opportunities to train with the F/A-18 aircraft in joint-service exercises with the Navy. But this event marks one of the few times the Air Force has had an opportunity to train with the MiG-29, an aircraft usually employed by countries not friendly to the United States.
Air Force F-15 pilots have expressed great satisfaction in how the exercise is going so far.
"The chance to fly against a real MiG in simulated combat is the test of any fighter pilot,” said Navy Lt. Abe Bush, an F-15 pilot and 67th Fighter Squadron flight commander. “We train day in and day out to counter such threats as the MiG, though at Kadena we can only try to simulate it with another F-15; there is no substitution for seeing the real thing.”
Cope Taufan not only provides a rare opportunity to train against unique aircraft, it is also a chance to foster relationships with an ally in the Pacific region.
"After flying against one of their MiG-29 pilots, I can see they are no different than us when it comes to their love of their jets, love of flying and intense pride in their country,” said Capt. Kirby Ensser, 67th FS.
“The opportunity within Cope Taufan drives both countries to think about their respective capabilities and limitations,” the captain said. “The bottom line is that this deployment really benefits the entire spectrum of participants -- Team Kadena, the Air Force, and the Royal Malaysian Air Force -- because every warrior, no matter how skilled, knows there is always room for improvement." -
Looks like we aren't the only guys cosy with Uncle Sam nowadays. Maybe we shouldn't be that dependent on them for our national survival in a possible protracted war in the future.
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Ha ha, what a joke. Msia promoting peace and stability . Maybe because Thailand, Indonesia and Singapore aren't in the Pacific , thats why Msia isn't promoting peace nor stability with us nor the Thais and Indos.
“This global engagement is fostering mutually beneficial relations with Malaysia, which facilitates peace and stability in the Pacific region."
. But this event marks one of the few times the Air Force has had an opportunity to train with the MiG-29, an aircraft usually employed by countries not friendly to the United States.
"The chance to fly against a real MiG in simulated combat is the test of any fighter pilot,” said Navy Lt. Abe Bush, an F-15 pilot and 67th Fighter Squadron flight commander. “We train day in and day out to counter such threats as the MiG, though at Kadena we can only try to simulate it with another F-15; there is no substitution for seeing the real thing.”
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Think deeper. The real issue here is not to train with RMAF , but to TRAIN against the MIGs. I guess the USAF is training with them in order to devise counter measures against the MiGs.
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sharp observation.Originally posted by pufferfish_79:Ha ha, what a joke. Msia promoting peace and stability . Maybe because Thailand, Indonesia and Singapore aren't in the Pacific , thats why Msia isn't promoting peace nor stability with us nor the Thais and Indos.
Think deeper. The real issue here is not to train with RMAF , but to TRAIN against the MIGs. I guess the USAF is training with them in order to devise counter measures against the MiGs. 
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Actually this is sort of "pay back" if you will for our help on funneling of important intel on the movement terror suspects here in malaysia and elsewhere to our partners in the region including uncle sam, the war on terror is high on the President's mind. Due to religious sensitiviities we cannot overtly support so we can only do it covertly and being mindful to our situation the americans have chosen an "joint air exercise" as sort of due.
The exercise could be conditioning for american pilots as not only malaysia operate the MIG but also many other middle eastern countries as well.
If you think deeper still such exercises it is unavoidable that pilots from different countries will learn from each other the strength and weaknesses battlesystems they operate and develop tactical countermeasures to circumvent problems. And I think it is good we learn about the capabilities about the F15.
Couldn't we wait to learn eventually about the system in a joint exercise when singapore starts operating the F15? While a joint air exercise cannot be ruled out in the future but in my own opnion it wouldn't be so soon neither would it be politically correct for either side of the causeway to be asking for such an exercise merely to learn about each other capabilities or weaknesses as information on such capabilities would be treated as sensitive and nobody takes national security for granted hence both sides would have to go thru third parties for the time being until we're all fully operational in the use of our new systems, I suppose eventually singapore will conduct air exercises with india as they too operate the SU30 , seeing as how your trade with india has grown. -
we already have joint air exercises with india...SINDEX 2004 and SINDEX 2006 i think
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you are rightOriginally posted by sgFish:we already have joint air exercises with india...SINDEX 2004 and SINDEX 2006 i think -
Originally posted by pufferfish_79:... the USAF is training with them in order to devise counter measures against the MiGs.
Well, we can go on-&-on-&-on in arguing who is the Exploiter and the Exploited in this exercise, the fact remains that BOTH the USAF & the RMAF are using such exercises to gauge the strengths & weaknesses of the MiG-29 & F-15 respectively and therefore could exploit the opposing jet's weaknesses in the event of ..... you guys can imagine it here.Originally posted by ahbung_ahdid:...And I think it is good we learn about the capabilities about the F15.
Couldn't we wait to learn eventually about the system in a joint exercise when singapore starts operating the F15? While a joint air exercise cannot be ruled out in the future but in my own opnion it wouldn't be so soon neither would it be politically correct for either side of the causeway to be asking for such an exercise ...
Likewise, this is also applicable as seen in the USAF-IAF (India, I mean) in the F-15/Su-30 face-off and RSAF/IAF in the F-16/SU-30 exercises. You don't need a military expert to decipher the REAL INTENT of such exercises.
As for the possible joint exercise (in the future) between RMAF MiG-29/SU-30 & RSAF F-16/F-15, I couln't agree more with what ahbung_ahdid reasoning that 'it wouldn't be so soon'. Even though both air services would be interested to have some sort of 'interoperability', I seriously doubt both sides would be WILLING to show off the true capabilities of its jets esp since the type used (& intended by its manufacturers) are to counter each other!
I am not bemoaning the lack of such exercises but I think such 'joint exercises' or 'trying to learn from each other' are only restricted to IF the same type of planes are used eg, C-130 or F-5s or in the area of SAR. (Frankly, I have not seen any pics of RSAF & RMAF F-5s in the air together, have you?). Therefore, both air services will seek out OTHER services that uses the type used by the other.
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Well analysed. It's only logical if Malaysia is particularly keen on the general capability of the F-15s. Similarly for Singapore to be interested in what the SU30 can dish out. But in any military exercises, both parties usually keep some cards under their sleeves.
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BTW, Uncle Sam don't really need Malaysia to train their pilots against real life Mig 29s. What the US spokesperson said was just bull dung. He could have done better without risking sounding like girl scout.
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Agreed.Originally posted by ferryman2393:Well analysed. It's only logical if Malaysia is particularly keen on the general capability of the F-15s. Similarly for Singapore to be interested in what the SU30 can dish out. But in any military exercises, both parties usually keep some cards under their sleeves.
It is interesting to note that Malaysia is using the MiG-29N which is a relatively capable version of the Fulcrum family. The Americans are using the F-15C in this case which is a very different aircraft from the F-15T bought by Singapore. The F-15C is a air superiority fighter whereas the F-15T is optimized for strike.
Similarly, India's Su-30MKI is configured differently from Malaysia's Su-30MKM. Therefore such exercises will only be a rough gauge of how each type measures up against the other. The sensitive or special capabilities of each type will be kept under wraps most of the time in bilateral exercises. -
The USAF have already done that with the Luftwaffe's FulcrumsOriginally posted by pufferfish_79:Think deeper. The real issue here is not to train with RMAF , but to TRAIN against the MIGs. I guess the USAF is training with them in order to devise counter measures against the MiGs. -
Not to mention that the US have also bought and dissected a couple of MiG-29s for assesment.
Chances are, they are just interested to see where the RMAF stands in terms of their capabilities. If i were them, I'd like to check out if they've got an upgraded radar and find ways to record their radar signatures to update RWRs.