PRINCE Harry to be guarded by personal SAS detachment when..
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...posted abroad!
THE AUSTRALIAN
February 6, 2006 Monday
HEADLINE: SAS to mind Harry on royal guard duty
The Sunday Times
BYLINE: David Leppard
London
PRINCE Harry is to be guarded by his own detachment of SAS soldiers during military operations abroad, under plans being considered by Britain's Ministry of Defence.
The prince, third in line to the throne, is likely to require at least a three-man or four-man SAS unit to protect him, because he is considered a terrorist target when on military duty abroad.
Senior army officers are in talks with aides at Clarence House, the royal London residence, on the most effective way to protect Harry.
Some officers involved in the talks have expressed opposition to the plan, saying it will divert SAS resources from their duties.
But military commanders have been presented with a dilemma after the prince, due to complete his officer training at Sandhurst in April, said he was determined to go on operations and be treated as normally as possible.
The ministry confirmed that Harry, 21, would take on the post of a troop commander in the Blues and Royals, a regiment of the Household Cavalry.
But officials played down reports the prince would be sent to Iraq next year. A spokesman said no decision had been made about the deployment of British forces to Iraq. However, he added: ''If his squadron does go to Iraq, he will probably go with it.''
As a troop commander, the prince will have the rank of cornet, in charge of 11 men and four light tanks. He will be given control of his own Scimitar armoured vehicle.
The tanks are part of reconnaissance formations that serve as the furthest forward -- and most vulnerable -- units in a battle area. Their job is to act as the army's eyes and ears, operating ahead of the troops, and gathering intelligence about the movement of enemy forces.
Any SAS unit given the job of protecting the prince would have to travel alongside his unit in a separate vehicle.
SAS troops traditionally act as bodyguards when members of the royal family, the prime minister and other senior ministers visit danger areas such as Iraq, Kosovo or Northern Ireland.
But military experts say it is unprecedented for the elite regiment to be asked to take part in permanent protection duty involving royals on military operations abroad. They point out that Harry would have plenty of protection around him in his own army unit, and said it would not be the best use of the SAS regiment's valuable skills.
However, the ministry is aware of the risks Harry would be taking in combat zones.
''The army wouldn't want to take the blame if the third in line to the British throne got wiped out,'' an official said.
A spokesman for Clarence House said he could not discuss the protection arrangements. -
Anyone knows what a Scimitar vehicle looks like?
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Scimitar... looks like our neighbour's Scorpion tank. Same manufacturer... Alvis.
But the Scimitar is armed with a 30mm cannon, as opposed to the 76mm gun of the Scorpion. Check out the web page below.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FV107_Scimitar -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FV107_ScimitarOriginally posted by specfore:Scimitar... looks like our neighbour's Scorpion tank. Same manufacturer... Alvis.
But the Scimitar is armed with a 30mm cannon, as opposed to the 76mm gun of the Scorpion. Check out the web page below.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FV107_Scimitar -
Stupid. What they can do is simply transfer a few of these men from the SAS to form a special detachment to guard the Prince.
Keeps both SAS and the Royal Family Happy. -
Him a terrorist target?
They got their priorities all wrong. -
And the SAS troops could learn a thing or two about armoured recce ops.Originally posted by Shotgun:Stupid. What they can do is simply transfer a few of these men from the SAS to form a special detachment to guard the Prince.
Keeps both SAS and the Royal Family Happy. -
he chose to sign on. he chose that risk.
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I have just heard from your Captain (of H.M.S. Collingwood) that all leave is stopped on account of the European situation and he has asked me for my instructions concerning your coming on leave on Friday as arranged. I have answered that of course you could not have leave until the situation has become normal again.
King George V letter to his second son, Midshipman Prince Albert, on the eve of WWI
I've not investigated, but I think that the British royalty tends to serve a stint in the Military, usually the Navy. -
I believe that almost all male british royalty has served in the royal navy.Usually at a junior officer level. I believe their dad serve in the RNOriginally posted by Si Geena:I have just heard from your Captain (of H.M.S. Collingwood) that all leave is stopped on account of the European situation and he has asked me for my instructions concerning your coming on leave on Friday as arranged. I have answered that of course you could not have leave until the situation has become normal again.
King George V letter to his second son, Midshipman Prince Albert, on the eve of WWI
I've not investigated, but I think that the British royalty tends to serve a stint in the Military, usually the Navy.
From WikipediaThe military training of The Prince of Wales, taking place in the early 1970s, included helicopter pilot flying as well as being qualified as a fighter pilot. During The Prince's years in the Royal Air Force and Royal Navy, he came to fly the following fighter aircraft (the WWII vintage Spitfire arguably having more of a historical/symbolic value than practical importance):
Chipmunk basic pilot trainer
Harrier T Mk.4 V/STOL fighter
Jet Provost jet pilot trainer
Nimrod maritime patrol aircraft
F-4 Phantom II fighter jet
Spitfire classic WWII fighter
Prince Charles served in the Royal Navy for five years:
1971–72: HMS Norfolk
1972–73: HMS Minerva
1974: HMS Jupiter
1974–75: Helicopter flying training at RNAS Yeovilton
1975: Pilot with 845 NAS on HMS Hermes
1976: Captain, HMS Bronington
[edit]
Official residence -
I think the political and threat scene has changed much since Prince Charles ( his father) , Princes Andrew and Edward ( his uncles) were serving in the British Forces.
It is not that the government now has chose to guard Prince Harry more closely. For example, Prince Andrew was also a popular figure in the days before he was married but he was deployed to the Falklands as a heli pilot , with a very high chance of being shot down by the Argentinians.
There are a couple of new things which are different from the old days:-
1) Radical terrorist threats against the Royal family. Please note that current terrorism differs from the IRA threats in the 70s and 80s
2) Because of Prince Harry's chosen vocation ( his dad and uncle had opted to be in the Royal Navy)... he will be exposed to more threats to his person. Usually the Royal family members have opted to be in the navy, where at least the threat environment is smaller ( i.e. on board ships). -
It's not true. Because quite a number of the British royal family served on ships during both world wars. Infact King George the V or the VI i'm not sure served on a ship that took part in the battle of Jutland. A few were deployed overseas in the 1800's. While some even fought Napolean!Originally posted by specfore:I think the political and threat scene has changed much since Prince Charles ( his father) , Princes Andrew and Edward ( his uncles) were serving in the British Forces.
It is not that the government now has chose to guard Prince Harry more closely. For example, Prince Andrew was also a popular figure in the days before he was married but he was deployed to the Falklands as a heli pilot , with a very high chance of being shot down by the Argentinians.
There are a couple of new things which are different from the old days:-
1) Radical terrorist threats against the Royal family. Please note that current terrorism differs from the IRA threats in the 70s and 80s
2) Because of Prince Harry's chosen vocation ( his dad and uncle had opted to be in the Royal Navy)... he will be exposed to more threats to his person. Usually the Royal family members have opted to be in the navy, where at least the threat environment is smaller ( i.e. on board ships). -
More in another forum regarding British royals fighting in war:Originally posted by |-|05|:It's not true. Because quite a number of the British royal family served on ships during both world wars. Infact King George the V or the VI i'm not sure served on a ship that took part in the battle of Jutland. A few were deployed overseas in the 1800's. While some even fought Napolean!
http://www.armchairgeneral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=37494 -
Yes, Prince Albert, the future King George VI, served as a Midshipman in the Battle of Jutland. He describes being in the fore turret of his ship and providing gunnery instructions and receiving enemy fire as well. I dare say they are hardly shielded from the press of the fight.Originally posted by |-|05|:It's not true. Because quite a number of the British royal family served on ships during both world wars. Infact King George the V or the VI i'm not sure served on a ship that took part in the battle of Jutland. A few were deployed overseas in the 1800's. While some even fought Napolean!
In fact, in my earlier post with the letter from King George V to Prince Albert, I thought it was indicative of the spirit of the Royal Family.
King William IV also served in the Royal Navy as a Midshipman in the Battle of Cape St Vincent in 1780. Seems like they do get stuck in. -
In days of old, kings and princes were often the commanders and leaders of their army. And naturally, they were well protected.
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Yea but not really. A King of England once refused to send reinforcement to his son the prince even though the latter was hard pressed and requested for it. He did however send a few knights to take a look at the situation should he really need help.I believe this was at Agincourt.Originally posted by Shotgun:In days of old, kings and princes were often the commanders and leaders of their army. And naturally, they were well protected.
Anyway yes but sometimes the Kings and Princes lead from the front too. -
you are talking about the "Black Prince".Originally posted by |-|05|:Yea but not really. A King of England once refused to send reinforcement to his son the prince even though the latter was hard pressed and requested for it. He did however send a few knights to take a look at the situation should he really need help.I believe this was at Agincourt.
Anyway yes but sometimes the Kings and Princes lead from the front too.
the real reason could be that there are no more troops to send. -
It is not just when he is on "patrol" or operation... how about when he is sleeping in his "bunk" or eating in the officers' mess.. some bodyguard will be handy to keep an eye on him.Originally posted by Manager433:...posted abroad!
THE AUSTRALIAN
February 6, 2006 Monday
HEADLINE: SAS to mind Harry on royal guard duty
The Sunday Times
BYLINE: David Leppard
London
PRINCE Harry is to be guarded by his own detachment of SAS soldiers during military operations abroad, under plans being considered by Britain's Ministry of Defence.
The prince, third in line to the throne, is likely to require at least a three-man or four-man SAS unit to protect him, because he is considered a terrorist target when on military duty abroad.
Senior army officers are in talks with aides at Clarence House, the royal London residence, on the most effective way to protect Harry.
Some officers involved in the talks have expressed opposition to the plan, saying it will divert SAS resources from their duties.
But military commanders have been presented with a dilemma after the prince, due to complete his officer training at Sandhurst in April, said he was determined to go on operations and be treated as normally as possible.
The ministry confirmed that Harry, 21, would take on the post of a troop commander in the Blues and Royals, a regiment of the Household Cavalry.
But officials played down reports the prince would be sent to Iraq next year. A spokesman said no decision had been made about the deployment of British forces to Iraq. However, he added: ''If his squadron does go to Iraq, he will probably go with it.''
As a troop commander, the prince will have the rank of cornet, in charge of 11 men and four light tanks. He will be given control of his own Scimitar armoured vehicle.
The tanks are part of reconnaissance formations that serve as the furthest forward -- and most vulnerable -- units in a battle area. Their job is to act as the army's eyes and ears, operating ahead of the troops, and gathering intelligence about the movement of enemy forces.
Any SAS unit given the job of protecting the prince would have to travel alongside his unit in a separate vehicle.
SAS troops traditionally act as bodyguards when members of the royal family, the prime minister and other senior ministers visit danger areas such as Iraq, Kosovo or Northern Ireland.
But military experts say it is unprecedented for the elite regiment to be asked to take part in permanent protection duty involving royals on military operations abroad. They point out that Harry would have plenty of protection around him in his own army unit, and said it would not be the best use of the SAS regiment's valuable skills.
However, the ministry is aware of the risks Harry would be taking in combat zones.
''The army wouldn't want to take the blame if the third in line to the British throne got wiped out,'' an official said.
A spokesman for Clarence House said he could not discuss the protection arrangements. -
More than ever, killing a British Royal can be a right priority.
Terrorists always look for targets that give impact, something symbolic.
Killing the third in line to the throne means they are able to target a public figure higher up in the establishment, not just the usual civilians at buses or underground.
Note, there were always uproar from the public over the holes in security for the British Royals, especially the Queen, when maniacs can break into her bedroom or reporter posing as a household staff. -
Imagine a future Royal that applies to join the SAS.
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If I'm not mistaken, the members of the Royal Family tend to be, historically, involved with the Royal Navy.Originally posted by LazerLordz:Imagine a future Royal that applies to join the SAS.
The one prince (or perhaps the 1st prince) who tried to break the tradition was Prince Edward (? - I stand corrected), who had signed up with the Royal Marines but...ahem...failed to make the grade.
As for Prince William & Harry, given their military exposure with Sandhurst, it is not surprising that they are part of the Army contingent.
Whereas for a future Royal to join the SAS, even though it is good morale and PR for both the Royal Family & the UK MINDEF, I doubt the latter will 'openly' welcome that scenario! Given the SPEC OPs nature the the SAS, it is a disaster if THAT Royal is KIA or POW behind enemy lines! -
Even the Queen herself was a medic during the war.
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The RN is suppose to be the "senior" service....Originally posted by Black Aces:If I'm not mistaken, the members of the Royal Family tend to be, historically, involved with the Royal Navy.
The one prince (or perhaps the 1st prince) who tried to break the tradition was Prince Edward (? - I stand corrected), who had signed up with the Royal Marines but...ahem...failed to make the grade.
As for Prince William & Harry, given their military exposure with Sandhurst, it is not surprising that they are part of the Army contingent.
Whereas for a future Royal to join the SAS, even though it is good morale and PR for both the Royal Family & the UK MINDEF, I doubt the latter will 'openly' welcome that scenario! Given the SPEC OPs nature the the SAS, it is a disaster if THAT Royal is KIA or POW behind enemy lines!
I can't imagine a member of a royal family doing CQB in full battle gear..... ha ha. with guess mask and so on....
it would even be worst if he is accidentally killed during a live firing ex. -
Dude, if he went through the Sandhurst, you can rest assured he is more than ready to be a soldier.
And it has been reported is prince William is bloody fit! Amongst the fittest of his batch!
BUT, if he went to iraq and has his own SAS detachment to guard him, i imagine the CO can only be too glad!
Imagine. He needs to someone to conduct close target recce on an enemy objective. So he tells Harry to go to MGR xxx xxx, and Oh, can you tell your SAS guys to do some recce...it is on the way...