BREAKING NEWS: THAILAND BUYS 12 SUKHOI SU-30s
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Source: The Moscow Times
Monday, December 19, 2005. Issue 3319. Page 7.
Thailand Inks Deal for 12 Fighters
By Lyuba Pronina
Staff Writer
Bangkok is wrapping up its first-ever arms deal with Russia, which includes a dozen Sukhoi-30 fighter jets.
Russia has signed a preliminary agreement to sell $500 million worth of military aircraft to Thailand in what would be the first such deal with the traditional U.S. arms client.
"We signed a memorandum for 12 Sukhoi-30MKMs during President Vladimir Putin's visit [last week] to Malaysia," a senior official at Irkut, the privately controlled maker of the Sukhoi fighter, said Friday. Putin was in Malaysia for a summit of the Association of Southeast Asian Nations.
Thailand originally agreed to buy the jets last year but put off the deal after a tsunami that killed hundreds of thousands of people hit the region last December.
The Irkut executive, who spoke on condition of anonymity due to the sensitivity of negotiations, said the memorandum of understanding also included delivery of helicopters to Thailand.
"We have gone half the distance and expect to sign the contract in the first half of next year," said Alexei Fyodorov, Irkut board chairman.
"This is good news for Russia, we haven't sold a single cartridge to Thailand," said Konstantin Makiyenko, deputy head of the Center for Analysis of Strategies and Technologies. "It also means that Russia has taken over the region -- we have fighter jets in China, Malaysia, Indonesia, Vietnam and now Thailand."
Makiyenko estimated that the deal would bring Russia at least $500 million. Rosoboronexport, the state arms sales agency, was not available for comment Friday.
European Aeronautic Defense and Space, or EADS, on Friday closed a deal to buy 10 percent of Irkut.
EADS has paid $65.3 million for the stake, which Irkut president Oleg Demchenko said would go toward both Irkut's own programs and joint projects with EADS.
EADS has already worked with Irkut on the international promotion of its Be-200 amphibious craft.
Last year, Airbus, which is controlled by EADS, signed a $200 million, 10-year contract with Irkut for the delivery of components for its A320 family of passenger jets. -
Source: Bangkok Post
Military sale to Thailand means 'Russia controls region'
The Russian media reported this morning that the Thai government has agreed to a secret $500 million deal to buy Russian fighter jets and helicopters for the Royal Thai Air Force.
The reports made no mention of the Thai government's claim at home that this is to be a barter deal. Premier Thaksin Shinawatra also has never mentioned helicopters before, although he confirmed there might be a deal to obtain the 12 Sukhol-30 fighter jets.
"This is good news for Russia, we haven't sold a single cartridge to Thailand," enthused Konstantin Makiyenko, deputy head of the Center for Analysis of Strategies and Technologies to the Moscow Times today.
"It also means that Russia has taken over the region - we have fighter jets in China, Malaysia, Indonesia, Vietnam and now Thailand."
The Moscow media report said the deal is preliminary and was signed last week in Kuala Lumpur when President Vladimir Putin and Mr Thaksin were both at the East Asia Summit in Kuala Lumpur.
It said Russia has signed a preliminary agreement to sell $500 million worth of military aircraft to Thailand, and added it was "the first such deal with the traditional US arms client."
"We signed a memorandum for 12 Sukhoi-30MKMs during President Vladimir Putin's visit [last week] to Malaysia," a senior official at Irkut, the privately controlled maker of the Sukhoi fighter, was quoted as saying.
Thailand originally agreed to buy the jets last year but put off the deal after a tsunami that killed hundreds of thousands of people hit the region last December, said the Moscow reports.
The Irkut executive, who spoke on condition of anonymity due to the sensitivity of negotiations, said the memorandum of understanding also included delivery of helicopters to Thailand, according to Moscow reports.
"We have gone half the distance and expect to sign the contract in the first half of next year," said Alexei Fyodorov, Irkut board chairman.
Makiyenko estimated that the deal would bring Russia at least $500 million. Rosoboronexport, the state arms sales agency, was not available for comment to the Russian media. -
They have Vipers and Tiger IIs.... now they're getting Russian planes?
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/thailand/rtaf-equipment.htm
I wonder what this will do for maintenance and logistics. -
Only half the price of F15SG?
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electronics are expensive mah ....Originally posted by coolant:Only half the price of F15SG? -
Smart boys, the Thais.
The SU-30 is a much better plane than the F-15. PERIOD.
And cheaper...
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It all depens on tatical...Originally posted by tvdog:Smart boys, the Thais.
The SU-30 is a much better plane than the F-15. PERIOD.
And cheaper... -
only in maneuverability.Originally posted by tvdog:Smart boys, the Thais.
The SU-30 is a much better plane than the F-15. PERIOD.
And cheaper... -
I wonder what the planners in Mindef have to say about this now. Hah I hope they made the right damn choice.
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The F-15SGs are meant for strike... The Su-30 looks good on paper but is basically unproven technology, moreover the Russians are famous for overstating the capabilities of their weapons. With the most updated avionics, new APG-63V(3) radar, reliable F110-GE129 engines and AIM-120C5 missiles, the F-15SG will be a potent counter to any projected Flanker development, with the possible exception of the Su-35.Originally posted by tvdog:Smart boys, the Thais.
The SU-30 is a much better plane than the F-15. PERIOD.
And cheaper...
Any news as to the kinds of ground attack weapons the Thai AF will be getting along with the Su-30s? Will it be basic munitions like KAB-500 bombs and AS-14 missiles or more sophisticated weapons like the AS-17 or AS-18?
Interesting point to note that if the Thai AF acquires the AA-12 Adder BVRAAM as well they would have US BVRAAMs in the form of AIM-120C5 on the F-16A/Bs operated alongside the AA-12 on the Su-30s. -
I am surprised SU-30 was eliminated in the first round of the competition here.Originally posted by tvdog:Smart boys, the Thais.
The SU-30 is a much better plane than the F-15. PERIOD.
And cheaper... -
U need to consider the supply of parts,maintenance,combat and overhaul/maintenance
manuels etc in the life of the planes,say 20 years.
What if the power in Russia change hands and the future in charge
do not fulfill the obligations?
The deal like this usuallu come with repair/maintenance package.
The cost of maintenance in the life cycle is few times of the initial cost
of the planes.This is the part which will make big bucks ---for the suppiers.
U need a dedicated and skilleful work force to maintain a plane like SU 30.
Thai is a corrupted country.Can they deliver the requried dedication to
maintain?
Look at Thai CV.Cannot go to sea for lack of fund and trained personnels.But the lack of funding has restricted its operations and as a result, it was not deployed to support the UN mission in East Timor.
Will SU-30 become very expensive displays in Thai AB?
Any platforms .besides look great,must work great--ANY TIME,FIRST TIME AND
EVERY TIME.
Note the NO,----911!! -
Isn't that the most crucial thing in airframe design? The avionics/electronics etc can be changed, right?Originally posted by sgFish:only in maneuverability. -
did Singapore have any arm deals wif Russia?
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I hope the Thais are making the right decision ... this smacks too much of a boys toys game (everyone's getting them, so I should too !)... and yeah ... their logistics must be a nightmare right now ... with bits and pieces from all over the place .... chinese APCs, Stingray tanks, M60s, harriers, 3 different blocks of F-16s ... etc .....
and now flankers ! .....
I shall leave to the performance of the aircraft to other fellow armchair pundits over here ... but i expect more countries to be buying Russian aircraft in the future ... fact is, the americans (and European makers too )are pricing themselves out of the market ... F-16s used to be less than $30mil each ... but now super hornets, euro-fighters and strike eagles are going for like $45 to nearly $100million a pop ... not many countries can afford to throw these sort of money around ,... and if the basic unit cost of even a low cost JSF is going to be more than $40million a pop, many more countries are going to switch to russian planes i think ...
not that flankers are dirt cheap actually ... but because the russians showed willingness to barter trade .... they'll take things like palm oil (our dear chappies up north), and thai rice (I'm guessing ) ... and if you do not have the kind of money like we do to throw around like we do ... you'll go to the russians for an easy line of credit ....
Next big player on the block ... the Chinese .... J10 perhaps ? ... and why not ? ... the way the Russians are selling to everyone (especially the chinese), they are opening their legs real wide ... I'm sure the chinese are picking up on their learning curve ... and they do produce indigenous fighters already (e.g J-
, with assorted countries falling all over themselves to sell to the Chinese what they don't have, or don't know (yet) .... I think the Chinese will become a viable player in the fighter market in a generation .... -
Singapore uses the Igla anti-aircraft missile, which is of Russian design.
Maneuverability of aircraft is only one characteristic, and it is getting less important with time. More important are avionics compatibility, operational availability, and TCO. Most of the cost of the F-15SG is not in the airframe but the avionics, and it certainly has superior avionics compatibility and operational availability to the Su-30. It also probably has a lower TCO. The cost of operating a plane is several the purchase cost over the lifespan of the aircraft. For the F-15, there is a large and reliable source of spares, an efficient supply chain, and extensive maintentance experience. If we need a spare part to get an AOG plane up, we can order one off the shelf from Uncle Sam and have the plane flying in hours. For a Su-30, the spares may need to be produced specially for you, and lead time may be months since there is no user on the scale of the USAF for the F-15. A more maneuverable plane might win battles, but actually having your planes able to take off wins wars. -
Igla?Originally posted by ceecookie:did Singapore have any arm deals wif Russia? 
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We bought several hundred SA-18 short-range surface-to-air missiles in 1997 and subsequently obtained a license to produce additional missiles in Singapore.Originally posted by ceecookie:did Singapore have any arm deals wif Russia?
Singapore was also offered other weapons by the Russians such as S-300 long-range SAMs, Ka-50 and Mi-28 attack helicopters and Su-30/35 strike fighters. So far the SAF has preferred Western arms over these products. -
Hmm, my question is, will their ECM be Israeli or will they recieve the Sorbitsya as part of their deal?
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Oh, I heard the Malaysian Su-30s are gonna be based in Gong Kedak AB in Kelantan... Is there truth to that?
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Yeah i heard it too... Should be true as Kuantan is home to the MiG-29s and Butterworth is where the F/A-18s are based. Kelantan is a logical choice for basing given the long range of the Su-30s which can be deployed to any area of conflict in Thailand or Indonesia.Originally posted by Shotgun:Oh, I heard the Malaysian Su-30s are gonna be based in Gong Kedak AB in Kelantan... Is there truth to that? -
Anybody want to set up workshops for the SUs? Good business. Some say they may need frequent visits to the mechanics. Good customer base; Vietnam, Indonesia, Malaysia, now apparently Thailand. But no cash or credit cards; only palm oil, rice, chickens, or longans. LOL.
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Not surprising , they were knocked out of the first round of Korean competition as well.Originally posted by sgdiehard:I am surprised SU-30 was eliminated in the first round of the competition here.
Eventhough the initial price is cheap but avionics is questionable and life cost cycle cost will come to abt the same becos Russian weaponary are usually high maintainance.
Anyway, Thai first option was F-16C/Ds then next is the Gripen but Swede is not interested in chicken!!!
So only choice is the Russian SU-30s becos Russian accept barter trade!!!
So good or not , you decide, afterall most countries who can't pay cash for modern western a/c or embargo by the west go for SU-30!!!
European or middle east countries that are not embargo by the west all go for western a/c. -
Well, for 500mil, barter trade, it will be interesting to see what is really included.
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wow
