Mighty Japan DF
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A new bully is emerging in the neighbourhood ...... and people are still bitching about the old one that left more than 60 years before ? .... tsk tsk tsk ....
all this concern about Japan's remilitarization is misplaced, I think .....
there's another juggernaut coming up in the same neighbourhood .... and that one is the one we all should be watching .... -
the reason why they are doing it is because china is 'threatening them'. japan can do anything but without nuclear they will achieve nothing.Originally posted by 84mmrr:One more thing, I don't trust Japan not juz simply becoz they whitewashed their history. But look at their so called "helicopter destroyer":
Japan always have the ambition to possess an aircraft carrier but is limited by it's constitution. Now, they have bypassed their constitution to build two and blatently called it "helicopter destroyer". What other lies are they going to tell?
Why do Japan need an aircraft carrier? The OZ had given up their a/c and even China does not have one.
now china is aggressively expanding its military. the one that is really threatening is china. if their purpose is just to balance US then it is ok. but i seriously doubt so. they are trying to threaten taiwan.
and please stop being so paranoid about japan with so many countries have nuclear there is no chance of japan starting another war. -
The day the Japs invade us again...is the day when their leadership has gone nuts!Ha,they depend so much on trade with all parts of the world that the moment people start rejecting them...thats it...suck thumb.
And you guys may question,why does Japan require an aircraft carrier...what about here in ASEAN?Why is it that the Thais require an aircraft carrier which they can hardly afford? -
I suppose its a search light?
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Note my pre-condition is Taiwan under ChinaÂ’s control, for the time being, Taiwan is not in the camp of china, so any naval blockage has to deal with ROC Navy 1st. ThatÂ’s a different story which IÂ’m not intend to go furtherOriginally posted by laurence82:Does China at the moment have this capability to impose a naval blockage? -
this discussion went a long way during my absence. Just let me clarify why I believe Japan has not worried about deployability.Originally posted by laurence82:well, wars in the past are not fought for territorial possessions alone u noe
of coz deployability is very important
geez, if the the enemies forced a southward invasions, i got to make sure my airplanes and naval ships are deployed in the area already right? notice the japan isles like indonesia is spread out, not closeted...
and if they managed to land, i got to transfer my land hardware from one island to another right? its the sea which has has become a barrier to them, making them heavily relying on air and naval transport to transfer hardware to the area of action
how to compare to a frigging small singapore island where u can travel from jurong to pasir ris in one hr?
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/japan/jgsdf.htm
this could give you a rough picture of what i am talking abt...
First of all, deployability in Japan itself is a war of defence of japan. History tells us that Japan never did have to defend the japan islands. The first ever attempt by a foreign forces to land in japan was the Mongolian in 1281. They never reached japan proper because of kamikaze. In WW2 the allied forces were spared the tasks of attacking japan thanks to the two atomic bombs.
Secondly, the seas that surrounded the Japanese islands are the natural barriers for any possible assaults on japan proper. The only land facing japan is Pusan in korea but the korea strait is a good 300km away. Japan completely wiped out the whole Russian navy in the battle of Tsushima, at the korea strait in 1901. China is a sea away from Japan, even to the ryuku island! The closest foreign island to japan is Sakhalin island of Russia, north of Hokkaido. If there is problem deploying troops on japan island, Sakhalin island is a nightmare.
Thirdly, who are the Japanese perceived invaders? (enemies who intend to occupy!), and who has the capabilities? China is far far away and has no capabilities, Korea is unlikely, Russia? A different story to me, need to study more.
In modern days, major threats to japan come from nuclear attack, directly from missiles or aircrafts, or indirectly through terrorism, and naval blockade. If they fail in these two fronts, where they deploy their ground troops is of no significance. -
Before WW2 started, Japan had just won a war with Russia which the Japan Imperial Navy sank nearly the entire Russian Navy.
Not since the Mongolians had an Asian power defeat a Western Power. So Japan was feeling on top of the world, being the first Asian power.
After WW2, the world reverted back to Asia having no dominant power. Basically it's back to the old days with the European in charge.
China then became the next Asian military power.
Now China is a econmic powerhouse also.
China is now finding that it can also achieve a lot through a combination of economic and military muscle.
Its aggressive army of businessmen are already on the rampage buying up European, Canadian and American businesses including oil companies. It is also "colonising" the Indochinese countries by buying up their mineral mines, building factories. They are building factories in Vietnam - a former enemy - Cambodia, Burma etc.
The massive PLA stands as a force to kinda make sure things go smoothly. And it is also common for businessmen to cultivate relationships with PLA and government officials.
China is now apeshxt about the coming Olympics in 2008, being new kid in the WTO and the World Expo in 2010. So China will be very nice and do nothing to jeopardise its image.
For now it will tolerate all the nonsense of Chen Sui Bian and Koizumi. It will also not show too much force in the Spratlys. But make no mistake that China carries a very big stick and has shown its readiness to use it in the past. -
and when china become really very strong nobody knows for sure what they will do.
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could you elaborate on how china is "threatening" japan?Originally posted by dragg:the reason why they are doing it is because china is 'threatening them'. japan can do anything but without nuclear they will achieve nothing.
now china is aggressively expanding its military. the one that is really threatening is china. if their purpose is just to balance US then it is ok. but i seriously doubt so. they are trying to threaten taiwan.
and please stop being so paranoid about japan with so many countries have nuclear there is no chance of japan starting another war.
Why should singapore or any countries should feel the threat from china, other than taiwan, which is a domestic issue to china and many taiwanese?"
Germany went to war again against its neighbors and we see rising militarism in japan, what make you think "there is no chance of japan starting another war"? -
it is meaningless going over this topic over and over again.Originally posted by sgdiehard:could you elaborate on how china is "threatening" japan?
Why should singapore or any countries should feel the threat from china, other than taiwan, which is a domestic issue to china and many taiwanese?"
Germany went to war again against its neighbors and we see rising militarism in japan, what make you think "there is no chance of japan starting another war"? -
And what makes you think China won't start a regional war with their military expansion. If you want to harp on history, maybe you should read about the ancient Chinese dynasties, how each dynasty has went on to claim more and more land. Mongolia and Tibet which were once independent countries, and why is Tibet and part of Mongolia now under China, even Vietnam was once ruled by the Chinese? The way China is growing military and economically is akin to what Japan was going through before WW2. And that's the reason why other countries are afraid of China. As China grows, sooner or later, they will have to expand in order to feed its massive population. And if that should happen, then how?Originally posted by sgdiehard:could you elaborate on how china is "threatening" japan?
Why should singapore or any countries should feel the threat from china, other than taiwan, which is a domestic issue to china and many taiwanese?"
Germany went to war again against its neighbors and we see rising militarism in japan, what make you think "there is no chance of japan starting another war"? -
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I suspect there are some chinese communist party members in Singapore trying to sow hatred on the Japanese. Pls go back to Beijing if you are trying to sow discord between Singaporeans and Japanese. We love Japanese.Originally posted by sgdiehard:could you elaborate on how china is "threatening" japan?
Why should singapore or any countries should feel the threat from china, other than taiwan, which is a domestic issue to china and many taiwanese?"
Germany went to war again against its neighbors and we see rising militarism in japan, what make you think "there is no chance of japan starting another war"?
We are a peace loving country and we are open to everybody including the Japanese. -
Your history sucks. Mongolia was one country only when they ruled china, and they extended the kingdom all the way to europe. They were never independent countries. Vietnam was once ruled by the french too, so?Originally posted by mfscrewu:And what makes you think China won't start a regional war with their military expansion. If you want to harp on history, maybe you should read about the ancient Chinese dynasties, how each dynasty has went on to claim more and more land. Mongolia and Tibet which were once independent countries, and why is Tibet and part of Mongolia now under China, even Vietnam was once ruled by the Chinese? The way China is growing military and economically is akin to what Japan was going through before WW2. And that's the reason why other countries are afraid of China. As China grows, sooner or later, they will have to expand in order to feed its massive population. And if that should happen, then how?
China's map was first drawn in the 1800 during the qing dynasty, and that included mongolia, tibet and manchuria which were minorities region, and china was then ruled by the manchurians, a minority. So which countries did China invaded and annexed? the British just gave up their last colony in asia in 1997 and the portugese in 1999.
do you know what Japan did before WW2, before you say that "The way China is growing military and economically is akin to what Japan was going through before WW2". Over the last 150 yrs China was involved in its own civil wars, political turmoils, invaded by foreign forces...is there anything in its history that make you frightened of them, or it is because you don't know the history, or they are taking your jobs?
Is there threat from China? yes, economically and culturally. All the jobs will have to go to china because they are cheap and no less inefficient. Why do we have to re-learn our mandarin, unfortunately yes or our boss will send somebody to china.
So how? switch focus and imagine they are military threats in the future, on the basis that "how can you be sure that they won't"? build up your military arsenal in case a war starts? do we stand a chance? if china does intend on destabilizing any local government, they just do what the religious extremists do and plant bombs. If that happens, tell me how the america tells the difference between PRC chinese and singaporeans???
Want somemore wild imagination?
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like i say it is meaningless arguing.
china is much stronger than japan. they are trying to match the US. the possibility of china waging a war against taiwan is much higher than japan attacking anyone.
having said this we must also know it only affect regional stability in the far east, not us. -
Hey, call the police, No doubt u know the number right?Originally posted by Sid_Vicious:I suspect there are some chinese communist party members in Singapore trying to sow hatred on the Japanese. Pls go back to Beijing if you are trying to sow discord between Singaporeans and Japanese. We love Japanese.
We are a peace loving country and we are open to everybody including the Japanese. -
The Korean War.Originally posted by Gun:China had never declared war with US[/color] -
aiye, still love japanese, belly outdated one leh, I now love korean liao.Originally posted by Sid_Vicious:I suspect there are some chinese communist party members in Singapore trying to sow hatred on the Japanese. Pls go back to Beijing if you are trying to sow discord between Singaporeans and Japanese. We love Japanese.
We are a peace loving country and we are open to everybody including the Japanese. -
those tear-jerking dramas.Originally posted by sgdiehard:aiye, still love japanese, belly outdated one leh, I now love korean liao.
why always must die of terminal disease? -
Actually, surprise surprise, or no surprise really:Originally posted by sgdiehard:Is there threat from China? yes, economically and culturally. All the jobs will have to go to china because they are cheap and no less inefficient. Why do we have to re-learn our mandarin, unfortunately yes or our boss will send somebody to china.
Chinese businessmen are building factories in Indochina because it is cheaper than China.
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Originally posted by dragg:like i say it is meaningless arguing.
you have no new points to bring up, you cannot substantiate what you said. why are you here?Originally posted by dragg:it is meaningless going over this topic over and over again. -
It is not cheaper, but they need to manufacture outside to beat american import quota, especially those in the textile industries.Originally posted by tvdog:Actually, surprise surprise, or no surprise really:
Chinese businessmen are building factories in Indochina because it is cheaper than China. -
to let you win.Originally posted by sgdiehard:you have no new points to bring up, you cannot substantiate what you said. why are you here?
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It's cheaper, TIME magazine said so.Originally posted by sgdiehard:It is not cheaper, but they need to manufacture outside to beat american import quota, especially those in the textile industries.