Section Automatic Weapon(SAW)
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Oops!Originally posted by tvdog:My friend, 100-round drum, not 30 round drum.
The Ultimax drums were reported to fall out of the weapon easily. Must be the reason why they are not issued for training. The main strength of the Ultimax is also its weakness. In many WW2 mag-fed SAW including 3 of the examples I posted above, gravity must've been the reason why the magazines were often designed to be on top of the weapon.
Sorry! Too quick on the keyboard... 
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So maybe they should re-design the magazines and weapon and add a lil additional catch to keep them together.
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for those chaps who have used the 100 round mags before ? ... any problems with the mag catch holding such a heavy load ? ... i mean, it doesn't look like a very sturdy design to me to begin with ... just a metal strip with two nipples to poke into the lobangs in the mag eh ....
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There were reports of the drum falling off in the initial models. I don't know if they fixed the problem later on.
I have only ever fired the SAW with live ammo on 2 occassions and these were with the 30-round mag.
I think it is a real bummer not to issue the 100-round drum for training use. It would be very useful just for the SAW gunners to get used to walking around the bush with the drum.
So the fact that the drums are not issued could mean that they are prone to some kinds of breakages. Or maybe the drums don't work well with our cheapo plastic blanks.
The Indonesians, Philippines and even the Croatian and some other Eastern European countries have armed some of their troops with Ultimax 100.
During the conflict in Yugoslavia I saw in TIME magazine a picture of a Croat guardsman using a U100 with the drum. -
I remeber during my standby period, 2 ntm force, we had one occasion whereby we had to loadup the magazines . thats the closest I ever get to the 100 rd drum! We alawys use the 30 rders!
YEah! all users have no experience on using the mytical 100 rd drums...
My experience with drum mags are the Beta Cmag on the M16 and HK MP5 system! in harsh environment, they will jam when sand and dirt get into the drums. Same thing with the Russian and Chinese 75 rd drums for the AK. Just feel that they cannot take the abuse and they are a **tch to maintain and clean. awkward to load and resuply.
DaveC -
Perhaps they should look into re-doing those 100 round mags, M249 style.
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Well, in other words, convert the U100 to a belt feed weapon.
One of the longest-serving and most widely distributed Soviet-bloc SAW is the RPD. It has a drum mag, but it holds 100 rounds of 7.62x39mm belted ammo.
Designed in 1944, replaced in the 60's by the RPK. But the RPD can still be encountered in many former bloc armies. -
I don't vouch for the reliability of the info on this forum but it's an interesting read on the Ultimax vs M249:
http://www.worldaffairsboard.com/showthread.php?t=5680 -
but Ultimax 100 dont like fire blanks!
go range no problem
go exercise jam like whole bottle of kaya inside -
That's becos they only put small amount of gun powder in each blank, safety perhaps.Originally posted by fartboystinks:but Ultimax 100 dont like fire blanks!
go range no problem
go exercise jam like whole bottle of kaya inside -
I wonder if other countries use cheapo plastic blanks like us? They are so weak even the small M16 bolt carrier cannot cycle. Ultimax longer bolt always IA.
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that's true ... the U100 doesn't like blanks, but i think it's simply the low quality of the blanks that we use .... though another draw back is the design of the bolt carrier group .... it's a pain to strip and assemble .... harder than the M16 anyway ...
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Well, it's not just blanks.
One time during live-firing I borrowed a SAW from my SAW gunner friend in the platoon. While firing short-bursts from a 30-round box, like they teach us, a double-feeding occurred. It was so bad that the instructors took about 15 minutes to free the 2 rounds that were jammed at the chamber.
I didn't examine the condition of the weapon as I only borrowed it but it must've been quite worn out. -
might it be the mags ? ... most times it's the mags that caused the troubles in situations like this ... and we all know how fucked up the mags are ....Originally posted by tvdog:Well, it's not just blanks.
One time during live-firing I borrowed a SAW from my SAW gunner friend in the platoon. While firing short-bursts from a 30-round box, like they teach us, a double-feeding occurred. It was so bad that the instructors took about 15 minutes to free the 2 rounds that were jammed at the chamber.
I didn't examine the condition of the weapon as I only borrowed it but it must've been quite worn out.
most double feeding occurs because of out of whack mag lips, causes two cartridges to pop out when the bolt moves back against the mag lip instead of one .... i'm wary of those mags so worn out it's white and shiny around the edges ... and what's the point of having a 30 round mag if you can only safely load 25 rounds in it because of bad springs ? .... -
the point being to treat your saw as a sniper rifle..?Originally posted by Fatum:might it be the mags ? ... most times it's the mags that caused the troubles in situations like this ... and we all know how fucked up the mags are ....
most double feeding occurs because of out of whack mag lips, causes two cartridges to pop out when the bolt moves back against the mag lip instead of one .... i'm wary of those mags so worn out it's white and shiny around the edges ... and what's the point of having a 30 round mag if you can only safely load 25 rounds in it because of bad springs ? ....
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Becos you guys are using training weapons, wear and tear is part & parcel of any used weapon, but during war time , everyone getting brand new stockpiled weapons, jamming is practically non existance!!!!
So you cannot do comparsion with used weapons, SG I think have the largest stockpile of brand new weapons in SEA, becos of our large % are conscripts and our ability to equip any army with our large array of locally produced weapons!!!!
So in reality, how many armies in SEA is capable of equipping all brand new weapons to the same level of SAF????
None!!!!
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I always wondered about if there was enough time for everyone to zero in their weopons when they finally breakout their stockpiled weopons in the warehouses?
Or will everyone just have to "aim off". -
Most of the reserve unit already zero their own personal weapon during the 1 or 2nd in camp & keep it for storage forever till situation require & for the rest of the remaining reservist life shall use the public training "cock up" weapon.Originally posted by insouciant:I always wondered about if there was enough time for everyone to zero in their weopons when they finally breakout their stockpiled weopons in the warehouses?
Or will everyone just have to "aim off".
Problem will not arise for zeroing if one-day button is press. -
Maybe because most of the users here aren't old enough?Originally posted by davechng:YEah! all users have no experience on using the mytical 100 rd drums...
DaveC
We did use the 100 rnd drums during range some 15+ years ago. Fam shoot for the recruits, too much ammo indented, PS had the foresight to bring along some drums (maybe explains the over indent). Drums in satchels were standard in Armskote then and SAW gunners carried them into field for training. They hated it .
Hand loading the drum mag is a PITA, max load by hand is about 50-60 rounds. But firing them is sweet.
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Really?
But then people get posted around like nobody's biz. Kinda hard to believe that the weopon will follow us around like our dockets. -
drum has always been a pain in the butt! Hard to load, hard to maintain! and they are usually quite fragile! My Beta C Mag for the M16 has to benhandle with care ! Dirt or sand get into it ! it can jam on you on your most crucial time! Keep it safe and clean!
They just need to change out the feeding mechanism and U100 would be a bomb to have!.
DaveC! -
Can anyone forsee a replacement of our U100 in the near future? If so with what? I think there is a LMG version of the SAR21, maybe it will be used. Come to think of it, we have already developed a whole range of weapons using SAR21 as the basis such as the P-rail,sharp-shooter, LMG and M203, but these are not being used yet.
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What about using Shrike LMG to replace U100? [/img]
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they jam cos of the ammo pouch...Originally posted by fartboystinks:but Ultimax 100 dont like fire blanks!
go range no problem
go exercise jam like whole bottle of kaya inside
if u clean the gas regs properly...and u take out the ammo pouch..it'll fire like nobodies business...untill its filled with carbon...my pc didnt mind me taking em out.....the onli downside is...when ppl are relaxing...u are out finding the cartridges...but to me its all worth it -
First of all, they cannot be classifed as LMG, as they are merely upgraded assault rifles given a heavy barrel, bipod and (sometimes) open-bolt firing. The British call their upgunned SA-80 Light Support Weapon.Originally posted by tankee1981:Can anyone forsee a replacement of our U100 in the near future? If so with what? I think there is a LMG version of the SAR21, maybe it will be used. Come to think of it, we have already developed a whole range of weapons using SAR21 as the basis such as the P-rail,sharp-shooter, LMG and M203, but these are not being used yet.
LSW weapons like the SA-80 LSW or the SAR-21 LSW have a built-in IA/stoppage problem: every 30-round you have to stop and change magazine.
It's bad enough that people try to turn 30-round mag assault rifles into support weapons but it's worse when these weapons are bullpup. Changing mags must be hell especially when prone with bipod. Not much of a "support weapon" if you ask me.